2001 Seadoo Sportster LE. Just got it!

[Bonmotwang]

I went back and unscrew the wet spark plug. I never tasted gasoline before, but I don't think it is water, more like gasoline I would say.
Also some yellowish greasy stuff on it.


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[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

If you're working in a garage with natural gas appliances, be careful about gasoline vapours.

 

[Bonmotwang]

Thanks for the reminder. I will be careful. The boat is in the garage. I will bring it to my buddy's house on Thursday to start the engine. He owned a few boats and into engine stuff. So he will supervise my work :-D


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[Bonmotwang]

Basic 101 question: if the battery is switched off, by rotating the PTO, is there any chance for spark generated on the spark plug or spark wire?


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[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Basic 101 question: if the battery is switched off, by rotating the PTO, is there any chance for spark generated on the spark plug or spark wire?


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No chance at all, also no chance of spark energy when the lanyard is removed from the DESS lanyard post. Why not just place the plug wire connectors onto the two grounding posts as intended and have at it as if performing a cylinder compression test? On my boat, I do this often, first thing I did was untangle the two plug wires from the bundle of hoses and wires they were integrated with by the factory.

 

[Bonmotwang]

Thanks. Now I feel safer :-D
Now I am looking for the two posts with my flash light.


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[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Those two posts are in the very back of the bilge near the transom about as far away from where they need to be as they can be, on top of the black plastic box where the ignition coils live.

 

[Bonmotwang]

Found them.

And so surprised that someone was able to writing notes at that spot. :-D


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[Bonmotwang]

Since the PTO is kind of loose, and not worrying about explosion, using my hand without the strap, I was able to do full rotation with the spark plug in place. Did feel two tight compression spots.
I thought the cylinder should be pretty tight, kind of air tight.
Does it mean my compression pressure is very very low because I can turn the Pot over by hand ?


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[Bonmotwang]

I do electronics for living and this should be the first thing I should have checked :-D
The battery voltage is 700mV!
Do I need to get a charger with "trickle" feature to recover the dead battery, or I need a new one?
Is it just a normal 12V car battery?

Reasons: Last fall, my son left the fish finder on, maybe the CD play too, then I took the boat out, had hard time to start, and start, and start, after I got her running, I only drove at pretty low speed for only about 5 minutes. so the battery was pretty much drained at that time. And the fish finder and CD player have been connected to the battery in the last 6 month, even they were turned off. Bad sleep mode design may still take uA current, which totally killed it.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

I do electronics for living and this should be the first thing I should have checked :-D
The battery voltage is 700mV!
Do I need to get a charger with "trickle" feature to recover the dead battery, or I need a new one?
Is it just a normal 12V car battery?

Reasons: Last fall, my son left the fish finder on, maybe the CD play too, then I took the boat out, had hard time to start, and start, and start, after I got her running, I only drove at pretty low speed for only about 5 minutes. so the battery was pretty much drained at that time. And the fish finder and CD player have been connected to the battery in the last 6 month, even they were turned off. Bad sleep mode design may still take uA current, which totally killed it.

Your battery might take a charge if it's not too old. The charging voltage must remain below the gassing voltage (about 14.4 volts in a normal lead-acid battery), so damage is unlikely, and in time the battery might return to a nominally charged state. Try starting off with a 2A rate and see if it can present a load current. Assuming the battery is several years old you might consider replacing it with another cranking battery (not deep cycle) of similar capacity, I think mine's over 650 CCA, maybe 750CCA, the larger the CCA capacity the better it will spin the starter but it still must fit into the space with the same type of terminals and location for ease of maintenance. Personally I use automotive batteries instead of the marine duty types we offer through the marina.

Most trickle chargers aren't meant to bring a battery back from a completely sulfated dead state, they are designed for maintaining charge over long periods of time without boiling it out. Perhaps if you don't have a charger the money is best spent on a new battery and an 800ma battery maintainer but if you have this problem occur again I would recommend an automatic type 2 ampere/10 ampere type charger, it's important the charger is automatic to avoid charging the battery too quickly or overcharging.

I use an 800ma battery maintainer to check my battery condition every few months during winter, each time I've connected it (through an stainless steel marine type cigarette lighter outlet I installed forward of the throttle controller area under the helm and connected directly to the battery terminals(always hot) for powering various 12v appliances) the maintainer didn't need to charge the battery.

Here's a photo of my 12v appliance connector I use to maintain the battery through, it has a map light built into the heater element that I use as a courtesy light at night:

 

[Bonmotwang]

I found a Group 24 Starting Battery, 1000MCA

http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/group-24-starting-battery-1000-mca-0102495p.html#.U2Etj_ldXNk

Premium marine starting battery
Engineered for power, stamina and reliability
Provides powerful and reliable starting
Can also provide auxiliary power for small loads such as lighting
Group size 24
1000 marine cranking amps, 115 minutes reserve capacity
Dimensions are 10-1/4 (L) x 6-13/16 (W) x 9-1/16" (H) (26 x 17 x 23 cm)
12-month free replacement, 30 month total warranty

Looks good to me. $105.

I think I should pay for the lesson, so that I don't get left with a low battery in the middle of the lake. :-D

How about the PTO turned over only by hand with spark plugs in place?
I shouldn't be too concerned, because the motor was performing last fall?

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

1000MCA is good, yep, yep, yep! Are those screw terminals (wingnut type) on top? Looks like both types, round post and screw terminal. Take old battery for recycling fee.

I dunno why the crankshaft is so easy to turn with plugs in, you need a compression test to know if okay, should blow 120psi or more.

 

[Bonmotwang]

Thanks man. Never bought a battery from store before. But just checked. the recycling fee is $15 without taking back an old one.

 

[Bonmotwang]

I dunno why the crankshaft is so easy to turn with plugs in, you need a compression test to know if okay, should blow 120psi or more.

Is this $29 kit is good enough for my test? Don't know the spark plug is 10mm or 12mm, or other standard.

http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/equus-compression-tester-kit-0251016p.html

Thanks. It is raining here.

 

[Bonmotwang]

Plan for tomorrow:

I just picked up the compression kit and the 1000MCA marine battery at Canadian Tire.

1) I will put the pump back to the boat, will not install the venturi yet. The pump is only to hold the drive shaft, because I don't want to take apart the drive shaft yet.
2) Put the air silencer back. I took it off just to have a "look" at the carburetor.
3) Put the new battery in.
4) Take the spark plugs off, turn power on, try the starter push to verify the starter is turning over the PTO.
5) install the compression gauge and one spark plug, hold the start button and watch the max reading on the gauge.
6) check the other cylinder.
7) Put both spark plugs back. get the hose on and turn on the water, try to start the engine to see if it starts normally.
8) if engine starts and idle normally, I think the next step is water test?

Any comments or warnings :lol:

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Remove both spark plugs during compression test, shut off fuel control valve and open throttle fully. Shifter in neutral. Attach compression gauge and crank engine until the compression gauge needle stops moving, (about 3~5 seconds cranking). Read gauge indication before pushing button to release pressure from gauge head.

The sequence of starting and stopping cooling water is important to avoid flooding engine with water:

Starting the engine running test:
Start engine first, then turn on water within 30 seconds and confirm some water comes from black plastic "pee hole" tell tale under transom hook above center of swim platform during running, most of the cooling water will exit the exhaust. If water doesn't come from "pee hole", you may need to pinch some engine cooling hoses.

Stopping the engine running test:
First before shutting off engine, shut off water then shut off engine after 30 seconds. The reason for shutting off water first and waiting 30 seconds is to blow remaining water out of the exhaust by using the exhaust pressure of the engine.

During long engine testing period more than a few minutes you can remove tension on the carbon ring by removing the stainless steel ring retaining "C" clip from the drive shaft groove, otherwise the carbon ring will overheat from friction.

Good luck.

 

[Bonmotwang]

Is the black port I connect the hose?

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[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

No! Those two are the bilge pump outlet and the fuel tank vent. The bilge pump outlet is the white colored one.

Connect the hose to the jet pump upper Port side of housing there is a tube with male hose thread fitting, this is where I connect my hose. If you follow this connection inside the bilge you will see it has a small clear line that leads directly to the exhaust outlet, you can pinch this clear hose using foreceps if necessary b/c it can cause too much wasted loss depending on your hose pressure/volume.

 

[Bonmotwang]

Ok. Thanks. Found the hole.
Report on the compression.
PTO side 90psi
The other side 65psi
Cranking sounded well :-D

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[IDoSeaDoo]

90 and 65? :ack: sounds like your top end is gone man.... Pour some oil (little amount) of oil in the cylinders, crank it over a few times to lube the cyl walls and try again. If your comp. comes back, it might run-in. Your rights might just be stuck. I'd take the head off and peer down. It's a no-risk procedure, there are no gaskets or anything. I'd def. want to know the shape of the pistons with such low compression. You should see 150 on each hole.

 

[Bonmotwang]

Trying to start engine now. Will report how it goes.


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[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

90 and 65? :ack: sounds like your top end is gone man.... Pour some oil (little amount) of oil in the cylinders, crank it over a few times to lube the cyl walls and try again. If your comp. comes back, it might run-in. Your rights might just be stuck. I'd take the head off and peer down. It's a no-risk procedure, there are no gaskets or anything. I'd def. want to know the shape of the pistons with such low compression. You should see 150 on each hole.

More than 5 drops of oil, hungry worms! I've measured as low as 120i on mine, and as high as 137psi, the most recent measurement using the same gauge each time was 130psi. The 120 measurement was after the boat had set for a couple weeks and the motor was stone cold, I guess there wasn't much oil up in the cylinder around the rings.

The first series of early 951's blew more, around 150psi I think. I've seen reports of ours blowing from 120~135psi

As a general rule of thumb a cylinder isn't gonna fire with less than 100, some of the old Johnson outboards with bathtub heads typically blow 95psi

A little bit of surface rust growing on the cylinder sleeves is likely to have some effect, hopefully not large, this point illustrates the importance of feeding your oil worms and keeping them from drowning in water.

On the 951, the metal head gasket must be replaced if the cylinder head is removed.

It's important to confirm the gauge reading method and calibration are correct before removing the cylinder head, never assume anything.

 

[Bonmotwang]

Ok, updates for the firing up test.

Long story short. The engine fired up eventually, and sounded pretty good (or sexy) to me. I had it run for about 60 seconds. But I shut off the engine before shut off the water. Did I flood the engine?

Here is the long version:
We cranked and cranked, the engine didn't start. But we could see the fuel filter is filling up. I cleaned up this filter cup last fall. So we thought it is the problem. But after the cup is full, still cannot start.
We checked the spark plugs, but good arcing.
We added small amount of gasoline directly into the cylinder. We heard a couple of pops when cranking. But still couldn't start the thing.
Then we took of the air silencer, and looked into the carburetors, added gasoline directly there, still no popping, no starting.
Then we used the throttle to pump the fuel, back and forth several times, no fuel coming into the carburetors. First problem located!
My friend took off the fuel line into the carburetor and connect a long clear pipe and started sucking the fuel out. The first part we got from the fuel was not good, maybe water in it according to my friend.
Then he kept sucking more fuel out until when he lower down the fuel line lower than the fuel level in the fuel tank, the fuel will come out.
Then we put the fuel line back.
Then we tried to start again, with some throttle and choke, man, she went off! Lot of water with antifreezer also with lake water coming out of the back. And lucky I was not too excited to forget turn on the water. We had it run for about 1 minute, and hit the stop. then I turn off the water after 15 seconds.

 

[Bonmotwang]

Concerned about I didn't turn off the water before shut off the engine. I just started the engine without hose twice. It ran no problem. Some water came out. I checked the RPM in the second time. It was 1250RPM.
Also the engine was vibrating a little there. Is it normal for a 2 stroke?


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