96 XP. Known perfect AGM battery but slow/delayed cranking when trying to start

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Yeah, hopefully it's a good kit. If yes then along with good cables that thing should spin over like new.

I don't think it's wise to connect one to a battery and let it free spin, b/c it might overspeed and that could damage it. Maybe a quick shot of juice but don't let it go full speed, might wipe something out.

 

[manolocross]

Have the battery load tested.. I had a agm ac delco brand new battery go bad in two weeks! I bought a solenoid, rebuilt starter and bought a new rectifier. Turned out to be the battery!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[dannyual767]

Have the battery load tested.. I had a agm ac delco brand new battery go bad in two weeks! I bought a solenoid, rebuilt starter and bought a new rectifier. Turned out to be the battery!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That is a good point. Two of my AGM batteries turn 2 yrs old this month. The other two AGM batteries came with the XPs when I bought them 2 1/2 yrs ago so they're probably 3 yrs old or more. I'll go ahead and take them to Advance Auto Parts and have them load tested just to be sure.

 

[dannyual767]

Starter rebuild kit came in yesterday and I installed it today. Boy is that circle, c-clip thing at the end of the starter shaft a total PITA to remove. And to replace! I've got two punctures in my left hand to show for it :facepalm: .

Both OEM brushes were worn well beyond the book limit. The main bearing was shot as well. It was an absolute PITA to remove as well. Cleaned everything real good. I really wanted to just spray everything with brake cleaner but my Clymer manual said not to do that so I didn't. I used rags and compressed air on the electrical parts. Some of the non-electrical starter body parts were greasy and grimy and I used brake cleaner on them.

Tomorrow I'll install this rebuilt starter into the problem ski along with some new battery cables. I'll post the results.

 

[jammin777]

you just had to remind me of that dreadful c clip didn't you? lol! hope it works out.

 

[IDoSeaDoo]

Sorry if someone already suggested this, didn't have time to read every post. A bad ground connection sounds unlikely but possible, as you're used two different starters. I assume you're connecting on the back side of the bolt, and not to the front? When trying the 2nd ground wire in parallel, make sure it's attached to a non-painted surface. I usually use a jumper cable from terminal to brass heat sensor or spark plug.

More likely, I'd say you're hydrolocking. You either have too much gas, oil or water (unlikely) in the cylinders. I've had a needle/seat be slighly jammed open and flood itself with gas and stop cranking altogether. Since your battery is so new and strong, you have enough juice to force some of the compression charge past the rings and actually crank over, but this is doing evil things to your starting system.

Take out the plugs and ground the wires. Place a clean paper towel over both holes and hit the starter. See what spits up onto the towel. If you hold it too there too long, it'll tear up the towel and try to suck it in on the intake stroke. (won't really hurt anything if it does though) If you smell gas REALLY strong or if it spits it out of the holes in a spray, I'd check your carbs. If oil, you could have a faulty RV Seal or bad Crank Seals, or both.

Good luck and always know where the nearest fire extinguisher is when you're working on this kidnda' stuff.

 

[dannyual767]

It's all good now!

Soldered together my 4ga, marine grade battery cables. They're a good bit bigger than the stock, 6ga cables. I was still able to use the rubber, cone shaped seals even though the cables were bigger in OD. Super tight but a little liquid dish soap helped them to slide on like they were greased! Used good terminal ends and adhesive type, heat shrink tubing. Here's some pics of them:


There is a stock, OEM 6ga cable in the pics for comparison.

You can see that I got the heat shrink tubing a little too hot (orange color.)

And finally, the obligatory video.
[video]http://smg.photobucket.com/user/dannyual767/media/IMG_04161.mp4.html[/video]

 

[falklandsx]

Nice! Where'd you buy the cable?

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

No more pencil-lead thin cables!

 

[Krispy]

What did you use for a crimper? And what did it all cost in materials?( if you don't mind me asking )


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Here's my go-to cable terminal crimper, it has an anvil inside and you smack the top with a hammer. ~$20 on the bay:

 

[dannyual767]

Nice! Where'd you buy the cable?

http://www.bestboatwire.com/

They're located in Brunswick, GA about 1 hr north of where I live. Mail order took 1 day for delivery!

 

[dannyual767]

What did you use for a crimper? And what did it all cost in materials?( if you don't mind me asking )


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

4 AWG Battery Cable Tinned Marine Grade Wire Red by the foot BC4RD 4.5' $7.16
4 AWG Battery Cable Tinned Marine Grade Wire Black by the foot BC4BK 2.5' $3.98
CL-Flux No Clean Liquid Flux for use with Solder Slug Pellets CL-FLUX 1 $5.19
Solder Slug Pellet for 4 AWG lug or terminal CL-4 8 $3.76
Cable Lug Battery Terminal Ring 4 AWG Stud Size 1/4 Inch 91025 7 $4.48
Cable Lug Battery Terminal Ring 6 AWG Stud Size 1/4 Inch 91015 1 (just an extra) $0.50
Subtotal $25.07
Shipping & Handling $5.80
Tax
$0.00
Grand Total (Incl.Tax) $30.87


I already had the heat shrink tubing (1/2" diameter, 3:1 shrink, adhesive lined.)

For anyone counting, I ordered a total of two extra terminal ends and two extra solder pellets.

 

[dannyual767]

I didn't use a crimper. I soldered the cable ends with a propane torch and Solder Slug Pellets for 4 AWG lugs.

Here is a link for instructions on how to do it:
http://www.delcity.net/documents/instructions/battery_solder_slug_install_instructions.jsp


Better yet, here is a video of how to do it!
http://www.delcity.net/documents/movies/battery_terminals.mpg


It was my first time ever doing it and it was very easy. The solder melted easily with the propane torch.


I've got a 2001 Ford F250SD 7.3L diesel with some heavy duty, 2/0 battery cables that have seen some better days. I'm planning on making my own to replace them.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

I like the soldering idea, it's probably superior to crimping.

 

[falklandsx]

Nice, Danny. I know its covered well on this thread, but post to the how-to section... Sticky worthy!

:thumbsup:

 

[68ragtop]

The only thing that would bother me is not knowing if the culprit was the starter or the cables seeing you did both at the same time. Just how my brian is. I'm glad you can move on & put this behind you though. Very nice work on the cables! thats nipping it in the butt.:thumbsup:

 

[IDoSeaDoo]

so that fixed it??

 

[dannyual767]

so that fixed it??

Post #57 is where I actually found out what was causing the hard, delayed cranking; bad battery cables.

These cables are 18 yrs old and are not in the same shape as when they were new. They probably should have been replaced many years ago.

The starter rebuild was just to help the starting system out since these starters are old, worn and have seen better days. Probably 18 yrs old as well and should have been rebuilt many years ago. $19 shipped for a starter rebuild kit wasn't bad at all.

Along with brand new, oversized battery cables, this ski should be cranking like new for a good while!

 

[dannyual767]

The only thing that would bother me is not knowing if the culprit was the starter or the cables seeing you did both at the same time. Just how my brian is. I'm glad you can move on & put this behind you though. Very nice work on the cables! thats nipping it in the butt.:thumbsup:

It was the cables. Rebuilt starter was just icing on the cake.

 

[IDoSeaDoo]

but I thought that you swapped out the cables out of a good-starting ski...

 

[dannyual767]

posted by IDoSeaDoo,

but I thought that you swapped out the cables out of a good-starting ski...

This is post #61 on page 3 of this epic thread:

Minnetonka and Coastie, you both are right. The reason that I said that I wasn't certain about the cables is because I never took all three of the good cables and installed them in place of the problem ski's three cables at one time. I replaced one cable at a time and the problem ski never cranked normally. Yesterday, in the video was the first time I actually had all three good cables in the problem ski at the same time. Right now, I'm suspecting that I may actually have two bad cables in the problem ski.

I was just trying to be certain of the cable situation and it totally surprised me that it worked. You may not be able to tell in the video but I was pretty much shocked that it cranked normally. I really didn't expect it to. I was just doing the cables to completely rule out the cables as the problem. Boy was I wrong! They are the problem! Whether it's one or more bad cables, they are the problem.


I also want to apologize to everyone who has spent time in this thread trying to help me fix this problem. I should have confirmed the cable situation several days ago.

I realized that I had more than one cable that was bad.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Good work man, see ya in 18 years!

 

[Coastiejoe]

posted by IDoSeaDoo,




This is post #61 on page 3 of this epic thread:




I realized that I had more than one cable that was bad.

90 percent of slow cranking or no cranking is a connection or cable issues.


Repairing and selling iPads, iPhones and Mini iPads.