tshorty454
New Member
i have a broken xp stock, it needs more power! any ideas for me to make some mods, the best performance upgrades anything will help.
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96 seadoo xp
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Stunnerable
Active Member
I'm going to have to really disagree with you there. I've been modding 800 X4 hulls since 95 and it is one of the easiest and rewarding PWC to modify. A few bolt on parts (a Factory Pipe, Arrestors and impeller) and they feel like they have another engine in there. The 96 XP (X4 800) isn't a boat for top speed. You can get 70 MPH out of them with a few grand of mods and a skilled tuner but they are more about acceleration and handling. My mildly modded 96 XP pulls harder than an RXP-X and pretty close to top speed but it KILLS it in the closed course. Thing turns harder than you can hold on. Oh yeah.. all this for less than half the price of a new RXP. The only thing I can't stress enough is you need a really strong or rebuilt 787 to mod upon. Point is, saying mods on an XP are a waste of time is absolute hogwash. Mod it brotha!!.. and beat the crap out of the 200+HP 4 stroke super yachts Sea-Doo now sells.
Could you guys explain what these parts are?
The Factory Pipe, flame arrestor, and which impeller?
Mine is pretty fun and fast, but maxes out around 55 mph. But it jumps OUT of the hole, literally leaves the water when you gun it. And turns on a dime like you say, and I have thrown myself off many times.
Anyways, Mine is stock, and has the flame arrestor and all the pipes on it are from the factory, so I assume you are talking about different aftermarket parts.
The Factory Pipe, flame arrestor, and which impeller?
Mine is pretty fun and fast, but maxes out around 55 mph. But it jumps OUT of the hole, literally leaves the water when you gun it. And turns on a dime like you say, and I have thrown myself off many times.
Anyways, Mine is stock, and has the flame arrestor and all the pipes on it are from the factory, so I assume you are talking about different aftermarket parts.
Stunnerable
Active Member
You seem new to the sport. In the beginning, you'll want to keep it simple. Remember, the more you mod a ski the higher your mechanical skills will need to be to keep it running at max performance. There are a few things I would recommend off the bat to make your ski really fun. First off, the handling department. In stock form the 96 XP is pretty tight and will exhilarate most riders. However, there are a few bolt on mods that turn your X4 hull into absolutely one of the best performance hulls ever made. It will cut through chop better, remove the porpoise (bouncing) at speed and give it a much more exact and tighter turning ability. It will actually blow your mind how much more fun the ski is with just these mods without getting into engine mods.
Handling mods:
Sponsons - the black tabs on the rear of the hull. I recommend Beach House. Here is a good read for you. http://www.atlanticjetsports.com/beach6.htm
Trim Tabs - On the bottom rear of your hull on ether side of the pump are rectangular black tabs. Those NEED to be replaced. This mod will smooth out your hull.. it will help you attain a higher top speed in choppy water. If you can find a set of good Westcoast tabs they work great but that company hasn't made a product for PWC in years. Or just get some R&D Racing 3 degree trim tabs. Do a search many companies sell them. Bout $100.
Intake Grate - The the piece of plastic (only OEM makes plastic grates) that bolts onto the hole in the bottom of your hull where the water is sucked into the pump. This is a topic that could start a big discussion. There are many different designs of greats and all of them have different applications. For instance, if your in surf or your racing, the Jet Dynamics grate give serious hookup in those situations but it will slow your boat down a couple MPH in calm water. For the best all around grate I would recommend the Worx grate. Found here: http://www.worxusa.com/ Or you could choose to not run a grate at all.. which is what I do. Takes getting used to but I never lose a holeshot in any conditions. Drag race not circuit race.
Okay, now for the engine mods. As I said earlier, you MUST have a pretty fresh 787 to mod because any of these mods will put much more strain on the engine. Weak engine = short lifespan = no fun! SO, assuming your engine is ready, I am going to list some engine mods.. however, don't expect to just purchase these parts, bolt them on an away you go. You'll need to find a good tuner to put this together and make these parts work together. I would also recommend calling Bill O'Neil at Watercraft Magic. The man knows more about these machines than should be legally allowed. Anyway..
Factory Pipe - This is a brand of pipe and the one that offers the most power for the 787 engine. http://www.factorypipe.com/p_seadoo.php This pipe with a few other mods will make that XP FLY!!!
Milled Head - you'll need to send your head (the thing the spark plugs bolt into) into a shop that can mill it for higher compression. If you talk to Bill he will know what needs to be done. You still will want to use pump gas so that can't go to high with the compression.. but it will help.
Carb Mod - It might be a good idea to send in those stock carburetors to get rebuild and modified for the new pipe. It's holeshot city after that.
Flame Arrestors - This is a no brainer mod. In order to make power your engine needs to process more air. Fly's or Proks are what I recommend.
Impeller - I saved this one for the engine mod category because the type and pitch of impeller is in direct correspondence to how much power your engine produces. That being said, you need to make a decision on which is more important; acceleration, speed or a balance. For me on any X4, it's acceleration. Hitting the gas and having it feel like your arms are going to come out of their sockets is WAAAY more fun than a few more miles per hour slapped onto the top end. But again, it's just my opinion. There are a few brands; Skat-Trak, Solas, Nujet.. etc. Again, if you call Bill he could really help you further in this decision.
That about does it from my end... there are many other mods you could do to your ski but in all honesty, your not ready. With the mods I listed you'll have a ski that will blow the doors off anything on the water from a stop and hit about 62-64MPH on the top end.. not to mention turn harder than anything you've ever ridden. Good luck and let us know how it goes!
Joe
seadoo GTS 1993
New Member
If you want a faster ski, buy a faster one... modding a 2-stroke shortens the life of the engine greatly.
OK, those sound cool. But you mentioned that it needs to be a fresh motor, and mine is a salt-water only (or at least 90% salt use) and it is the original. On a good note, the previous owners never got more than 8-10 hours a year use before it quit running, then it sat in their garage at the beach house for about 6 years before they gave it to me, so there is still some good life in it, but not enough to mod up.
I have a skat swirl in my Challenger and it really woke that critter up, so I know all about improved impeller design.
I will keep this post printed out for when I blow up the 787 and need a new one, then I will do all of this at one time.
One last thing...what is it about NO GRATE that takes some getting used to?
I have a skat swirl in my Challenger and it really woke that critter up, so I know all about improved impeller design.
I will keep this post printed out for when I blow up the 787 and need a new one, then I will do all of this at one time.
One last thing...what is it about NO GRATE that takes some getting used to?
popasodatastie
New Member
Prop job
:cheers: i have a 96 seadoo xp with the 787 cc rotax and it was stock when i bought it used i started out seeing what it ran and i got 57 to 60 mph i changed the prop for one that had more of a grab in the water and now i'm running 65 to 67 mph. its like a new ski also i've waxed the bottom of the hull and it accually reduces friction.
:cheers: i have a 96 seadoo xp with the 787 cc rotax and it was stock when i bought it used i started out seeing what it ran and i got 57 to 60 mph i changed the prop for one that had more of a grab in the water and now i'm running 65 to 67 mph. its like a new ski also i've waxed the bottom of the hull and it accually reduces friction.
Mods.....?
Joe, welcome to SDF. It seems you are very much a knowledgeable person when it comes to modding. Of course, with the help of Bill, anyone can be a racer in a season or two. He needs no introduction to the world of PWC.
The mod parts you describe are the same ones we recommend to people in our forum who want to look for a bit of extra "umphh" from their motors. We normally don't recommend engine mods because the largest portion of our members are novice users and want their older engines to last when they make a few fixes to them. Our community runs mostly the older 2 strokers but the 4-TEC's are starting to show up in force.
As you pointed out and seadoo 93 GTS pointed out, modding the older engines shortens the life span of the engine. The other downfall to this is, most like to ride for more than 15 minutes before looking for a gas station. Then, like Scooper says, if you want a faster ski, buy one.
But, we do have modders here. Our "Seadoowarehouse" parts distributer is also a distributer of after market parts as well. And from comparing the prices to the intake grate, a bit cheaper. Check out this link... http://www.rivayamaha.com/RivaStore/product_page.asp?Category=SD 97 XP Intake Grate and you'll find the same type grate. These grates are designed to help keep you hooked up in a tight turn and minimize cavitation in the hole shot.
But, the one thing most important is flame arrestor and exhaust systems. When you do this, you have got to re-jet your carbs because with the extra air flow, there will be less manifold pressure created. This will require larger jets to accommodate the extra fuel needed for the larger air volume.
If you read through our forum topics, we don't mind modding and some do it. But for the most part, most of us just barely have enough money to keep the boats yearly maintenance up.
We do agree on the pump mods, like the impellers but I'd also throw in the pump wedges and high performance nozzles, that require no additional work to the engine. At 7200 RPM, the engines powertrain has plenty of power to push an extra degree in impeller and create plenty more thrust with a power nozzle...........:cheers:
Joe, welcome to SDF. It seems you are very much a knowledgeable person when it comes to modding. Of course, with the help of Bill, anyone can be a racer in a season or two. He needs no introduction to the world of PWC.
The mod parts you describe are the same ones we recommend to people in our forum who want to look for a bit of extra "umphh" from their motors. We normally don't recommend engine mods because the largest portion of our members are novice users and want their older engines to last when they make a few fixes to them. Our community runs mostly the older 2 strokers but the 4-TEC's are starting to show up in force.
As you pointed out and seadoo 93 GTS pointed out, modding the older engines shortens the life span of the engine. The other downfall to this is, most like to ride for more than 15 minutes before looking for a gas station. Then, like Scooper says, if you want a faster ski, buy one.
But, we do have modders here. Our "Seadoowarehouse" parts distributer is also a distributer of after market parts as well. And from comparing the prices to the intake grate, a bit cheaper. Check out this link... http://www.rivayamaha.com/RivaStore/product_page.asp?Category=SD 97 XP Intake Grate and you'll find the same type grate. These grates are designed to help keep you hooked up in a tight turn and minimize cavitation in the hole shot.
But, the one thing most important is flame arrestor and exhaust systems. When you do this, you have got to re-jet your carbs because with the extra air flow, there will be less manifold pressure created. This will require larger jets to accommodate the extra fuel needed for the larger air volume.
If you read through our forum topics, we don't mind modding and some do it. But for the most part, most of us just barely have enough money to keep the boats yearly maintenance up.
We do agree on the pump mods, like the impellers but I'd also throw in the pump wedges and high performance nozzles, that require no additional work to the engine. At 7200 RPM, the engines powertrain has plenty of power to push an extra degree in impeller and create plenty more thrust with a power nozzle...........:cheers:
Stunnerable
Active Member
Thanks man. Yeah I've been in this sport for a very long time and have turned wrenches/raced with some of the legendary names of IJSBA racing and PWC in general. I think it's great that these guys have an interest in the older skis and specifically modding them.. for one, it ensures the older skis will be around for a long time and I for one consider them to be the best Sea-Doo ever made. Sure, the technology and attention to detail on the new skis rock the old ones, but the new ones are no where near as much fun. They are the soul of Watercraft as a hobby and what they were is whats missing in the sport today. As for the longevity of a modded 2 stroke.. yeah, it shortens the life.. a bit. It all boils down to how well the craft is built up. I stressed several times to these guys they need to find a really good tuner if they plan building up a rec modded ski and especially for a race ski.. Which MORE NEED TO BE DOING! Racing!
I'm glad to be a part of this forum and if anyone has a question or needs help, please feel free to ask.
Also, popasodatastie... I hate to burst your bubble but never ever will a stock 96 XP with just a prop mod hit anything over 59MPH let alone the 67MPH you quoted. It takes a lot to get high 60s out of an X4 hull because the hull was made for quick acceleration and turning. I've had X4's with top speeds of 61-62MPH blow the BNG off of RXP's.. but they will catch you... until you come to a corner.
If you want a ski for top speed go for a 99+ XPL with the Hyperbolic Vee hull or a 98+ GSXL. It's easy to get those skis up to 70 with a few mods. Leave the X4 hulls for the neck snapping acceleration and the wave jumping unless you love X4's as much as I do. lol
Stunnerable
Active Member
Sorry.. I didn't read your whole question before. When running no grate it changes the feel of the hull. At first is seems a little loose but then you realize it isn't.. it just makes transitioning faster. If you run a pump wedge and take off your grate you'll see 1-2MPH gain in top speed in anything up to 2' chop. It's actually pretty impressive. Some like it and others hate it. It's all a matter of preference.
jeffz0rz321
New Member
this was an awesome write up ! very informative and well thought out. i have learned a thing or two about my 96 xp 800 and what to doto get it a little meaner, but still reliable, thanks again !
slvr bulit
New Member
Great post Joe! I feel a little smarter just by reading it.
Stunnerable
Active Member
Thanks guys! Anytime. I love the old X4 hulls and anything to keep people riding them for many years to come. Hit me up if you want to ride of talk PWC. Happy Modding!
Joe
Joe
Stunnerable
Active Member
Yeah.. pretty much. The engine is different but the FP for the 720 does a great job. Although, I would HIGHTLY! recommend just buying a 96XP instead of spending the money on engine mods for a 95XP to make it as fast as a stock 96XP. I know how hard it can be to sell a ski. lol
97gsxRIDER
New Member
is a 97 gsx considered a x4 hull????
Stunnerable
Active Member
No man.
95: XP, XP800
96: XP
97-99: SPX
Thats it.
95: XP, XP800
96: XP
97-99: SPX
Thats it.
Stunnerable
Active Member
You are correct! OOPS!
Moto-Madness
New Member
Mod it up man. I agree with all the posts on here. I have a 95 XP and its probably the best and most fun hull I have ever ridden. The newer will never out corner or handle you. I've ridden with some of the newer skies and my X4 hull will turn and corner before the newer rxp's even know what hit them lol
You definitely need to properly tune and jet the carbs on these engines though
You definitely need to properly tune and jet the carbs on these engines though
Stunnerable
Active Member
Thanks man!
To answer your question.. yes an no.
The hull on the GSX is very different from the X4. You don't have trim tabs for one. Intake Grate mods and sponsons will do you right.
With the GSX I would consider a pump wedge to go along with sponsons and an intake grate because the wedge will allow more lift at top speed. You need more lift to counter the added drag of the other hull mods. You should see minimal speed loss with this approach.
As for the engine.. same applies.
Have fun!:hurray:
To answer your question.. yes an no.
The hull on the GSX is very different from the X4. You don't have trim tabs for one. Intake Grate mods and sponsons will do you right.
With the GSX I would consider a pump wedge to go along with sponsons and an intake grate because the wedge will allow more lift at top speed. You need more lift to counter the added drag of the other hull mods. You should see minimal speed loss with this approach.
As for the engine.. same applies.
Have fun!:hurray:
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