What is this mystery part?

[Arkansan]

In the past month, we've replaced the starter that sheared in two, removed a twist of rope and replaced the rubber boot at the impeller end of the driveshaft, adjusted one of the throttle cables, replaced the spark plugs and even replaced the stretched rubber strap that would no longer hold the ski pole in place. Yesterday afternoon, we had the BEST cruise on the lake in the two seasons we've had the boat. Both engines started immediately and ran beautifully. We went fast. It was just thrilling.

Before we pulled the boat out of the water, we looked in the engine compartment to see just how much water we had taken in. There wasn't much, but floating in it was this torn rubber ring. I looked at the parts list to figure out what it is and where it came from so we can determine if one is actually missing or whether it might have just been lost when the boat was worked on in a past life, but I just can't figure it out. So which of you experts can identify this mystery part and tell us how to determine whether it has already been replaced. If we're missing something vital, it certainly didn't keep the boat from running like the wind yesterday.



Thank you for your help!

 

[LouDoo]

Does the winner get a prize?

Impeller boot?

Lou

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUQkbXWwJhQ

 

[Arkansan]

Nope. My husband has had his head down in the engine compartment again, and he's now pretty sure it's the rubber boot from the OTHER end of the drive shaft. (We replaced the impeller boot a few weeks back, and this is larger than that.) I'll post another photo in a minute.

 

[Arkansan]

We think the mystery part is what's left of the rubber boot on the port engine. Part No. 272000001. Anyone think otherwise? I think I saw some detailed instructions on how to work on that end of the driveshaft somewhere when I was looking for help with our problem on the impeller end of the shaft.

 

[griz400]

a shot of marine grease 2 or 3 times a season would have saved you some money ....that looks ugly, if the sleeve wont move to take it all apart, looks like you will have to cut it all apart with a cutting wheel and a die grinder -- you have to try and get the clip out of the metal sleeve , after you do that pull the pump and see if your gonna need a pto and a driveshaft

 

[Arkansan]

Griz400, I have no idea what you just said. We bought this boat last season, and we had to have the port engine replaced. Where should we have put marine grease? And what looks ugly -- other than, of course, the fact that the rubber boot has been torn off? What do you think will have to be cut off and why? Remember, this thing was flying across the water 18 hours ago. Nothing is seized up. We only discovered the rubber boot because it was floating in the compartment at the end of our otherwise trouble-free cruise.

 

[Robj]

Just change the boot, easy job, 2 beers max. Just pull the pump, remove the seal and driveshaft and install the new boot. I would hope that when the engine was installed it was aligned properly, because the way the seal looks suggests that it may not be. Not sure on that one though, hard to tell from a picture.

 

[Arkansan]

Thanks, Robj. I just asked my husband whether the shaft might be out of alignment, and he said that was possible. We pulled the pump to install the impeller boot a few weeks back, so maybe we messed up the alignment? It was our first time to do that, but everything went back together smoothly and, as I said, the boat never ran better than last night. But here's something else to worry about: We can't find hide nor hair of either of the clamps that (presumably) held the boot in place. What you see in the photo above is what my husband found when he took the cover off the shaft. We've been feeling around with a telescoping magnet, and we've found a couple of washers, but no clamps. I went ahead and ordered the boot (272000001) and the two clamps (293650021 and 293650067). We will be out of state for the next two weekends, so it will be awhile before we get a chance to work on this again. When we get it all back together, how can we be sure of the shaft alignment?

PS: Let me say again just how helpful SeadooForum has been for us. Thank you all so much.

 

[Robj]

I just use plastic tie wraps to secure the boot. Cheap and easy. Removing the pump won't throw things out of alignment. It just looks like the ss ring is not sitting squarely on the carbon part. If you have the alignment tool I would check it, otherwise just run it like it is and possibly try and find a tool over the winter.

 

[Arkansan]

Okay, we went out and just manually turned the flywheels of both engines, and the port (the one missing the boot) does seem to be dragging or rubbing just a bit. It will be three weekends hence before we can work on this problem. We'll have the rubber boot and two clamps by then. Any and all suggestions on how we can make sure we do this right are very welcome. I should have known that last night's fabulous cruise was too good to be true.

 

[Arkansan]

If I had known we could use zipties, I could have saved $10 on the clamps! That's okay -- if you can't afford a $10 mistake, you can't afford a boat, right? We do not have the alignment tool. Is that something worth owning? Or should we maybe turn all this over to the certified Seadoo shop? We want to be able to DIY as much as is practical, but maybe this isn't practical? Thank you for your insight.

 

[griz400]

it all looks pretty dry to me , maybe im wrong (inside the pto) but looking at the carbon seal, its not aligned .....

cut away the rest of the boot and take another pic

 

[LouDoo]

Well, darn, I guess Griz wins the chicklets.

Lou

 

[dbracela]

I'm trying to figure out why the boot tore apart. It spins with the shaft and the pto, so the only thing I can think of is that maybe the splines started to strip and the shaft was slipping? You'll have to pull it out to get the new boot on anyway, so inspect the splines. Maybe do it before you leave so you can order parts, a shaft or pto (hopefully you won't have to). You guys seem to know how to pull the shaft already, so it shouldn't take ya too long.

What I did to have my engine aligned after install, was borrow an alignment tool from a shop. But I am now friends with the parts guy there so they cut me a deal. You could always bring the boat to a dealer to just have them align it, or rent the tool (you see them for rent in the classifieds or sbt), or buy one. I've had a seadoo mechanic tell me you can just eyeball it, but consensus on this forum says otherwise.

 

[Arkansan]

Griz, I should have taken another photo, but now the cover is back on the boat and we're getting ready to head home. You are probably right about the grease -- we haven't put any on it, but assumed that everything like that was taken care of when we had that engine replaced (by certified Seadoo dealer) last summer. We're learning everything from scratch on this boat. We probably need a checklist of Seadoo maintenance for dummies.

 

[Arkansan]

dbracela, which splines are you talking about? The ones in the PTO or the ones at the other end? This was something I wondered about when we replaced the impeller boot: How do the spines line themselves up? We just put everything back together and it ran, so we figured it was OK, but maybe that was dumb. Now I wonder if our repair to the impeller end messed up the PTO end. Am I making any sense at all?

 

[racerxxx]

You're gonna need a pair of these to do the clamps. You can borrow them from your local autoparts store if they do the tool loaner thing. Or buy a pair for $17 (Amazon). I prefer the oetiker clamps (what you ordered), to me cable ties and hose clamps look half assed, but probably work fine. Make sure the rubber bumpers are in the ends of the driveshaft so it doesn't float end to end more than it's supposed to.

Oetiker clamp pliers Used for installation and removal of the clamps

http://www.lislecorp.com/divisions/products/?product=161&division=1&category=4

Driveshaft bumpers--one in each end.

Put grease on the splines of the driveshaft when you reassemble it. Then once it it is completely assembled, pump grease in the grease fitting on the PTO, watch the boot plump up and the driveshaft push back towards the pump. Don't over fill it, do it slow and when the shaft stops moving back--stop. Seadoo has their own synthetic grease, I use Mobil-1 synthetic grease, available at you parts store or Walmart.

 

[Arkansan]

Bless you, Racerxxx. I don't know if we have that tool or not, but we'll find one. We bought the synthetic grease when we put the impeller boot on a few weeks back, so we're in good shape on that. And I know the driveshaft bumper is in place on the impeller end, but will make sure it's on the other end as well. And we'll put grease on the starboard PTO while we're at it. I'm going to repeat my question from above: How do the splines and grooves line themselves up? When we did the impeller boot, I wondered about that.

 

[Robj]

The only lining up you need to worry about is the engine and pump, for which you need a special tool, or you can do like I did and make one. There are seperate posts on this topic just do a search. Once the engine is lined up, you just install the shaft and then the pump, nothing else to worry about as far as alignment goes. Like I mentioned earlier maybe it is out of alignment which caused the boot to rip apart, not sure, just a WAG on my part. This is a very easy repair so don't get too stressed over it.

 

[dbracela]

Bless you, Racerxxx. I don't know if we have that tool or not, but we'll find one. We bought the synthetic grease when we put the impeller boot on a few weeks back, so we're in good shape on that. And I know the driveshaft bumper is in place on the impeller end, but will make sure it's on the other end as well. And we'll put grease on the starboard PTO while we're at it. I'm going to repeat my question from above: How do the splines and grooves line themselves up? When we did the impeller boot, I wondered about that.

If you didn't have the splines lined up up would have known it, because the shaft simply wouldn't slide into the impeller or pto. I'm sure you did that right. My theory about stripped splines is probably wrong, as you would have lost thrust on that side if the shaft stopped turning, and you definitely would have noticed that. Just peek at them anyway when you're replacing the boot.

 

[racerxxx]

If you need to get them aligned just rotate the pto while another person is putting the pump back on or use a wooden dowel through the back of the pump like I do to rotate the impeller a tad.

 

[Arkansan]

All fantastic advice and greatly appreciated. At first I was bummed to realize that we had another serious problem after such a great ride last night. But now I think it was a blessing to see that boot floating in the engine compartment and to diagnose the problem before a disater! I think we can fix this. And I think Griz is right about there not being grease where there should have been a lot if it! Learning, learning, learning.

 

[rjcress]

I just asked my husband whether the shaft might be out of alignment, and he said that was possible.

I laughed and shot coffee out my nose when I read this :lol:
I'm sure your husband is awesome, but one can't SEE whether the engine is out of alignment unless it is REALLY out of alignment. That is why they make a special alignment tool. Unless someone used an alignment tool to check it, then you have no way of knowing.

My guess on the PTO boot is that something came in contact with it while the engine was running. I don't see how else it could fail like it did.

Also, you said you need an easy checklist of maint. stuff.
You should download a copy of the owners manual for your boat. Seadoo did a pretty good job of providing a pretty simple maint. checklist in the operator's manual.

If you are going to attempt any maintenance yourselves, you really should have a shop manual for your boat (easy to download through the paid section of this forum, or elsewhere online for free). Some of the stuff that you said you don't understand (like where to put the grease) would have been explained in the directions you would have followed to replace the impeller boot, as you would have had to remove and reinstall the jet pump and drive shaft as part of that job.

 

[Arkansan]

Greetings, all. We are finally back on this project, which has been complicated as Griz predicted by the fact that we haven't been able to move the stainless ring back far enough to get at the clip. (The driveshaft will move independently of the stainless ring, so they aren't fused together, but it may be that the clip or ring -- not sure which we have -- seems to have moved out of the groove.) Taking a break right now and will get back at that shortly. Also reading earlier threads for advice on that. This engine was installed last summer by a certified Seadoo dealer, and I would think that the driveshaft, PTO boot, clip, etc., would have to have been removed and reinstalled then as well. Hmm.

RJCress, I have though long and hard about how to respond to you, and have decided to say this: I've been using this forum for almost a year and a half -- longer than you have -- and you are the first and only person who seemed eager to laugh at other people's problems and to belittle them for not knowing what they don't know. You remind me of something Dolly Parton once said about the people who treated her like a dumb blonde. "I didn't care, because I knew I wasn't dumb and I knew I wasn't a blonde, either."

(PS: We do have the manual. We bought it the same week we bought the boat. And my husband IS awesome, the finest, kindest person I've ever known. He may not know as much as some people about Seadoo maintenance, but he would never dream of making fun of someone else's problem.)

 

[Arkansan]

OK, a couple more hours of frustration later, we still haven't been able to remove the driveshaft. I know this isn't supposed to be this difficult, but we have been unable to move the stainless ring (aka floating ring) back (toward the stern) any further than the first groove (and we can't see any ring or clip in it that first groove, but we really haven't gotten a good look). Before you tell us to just push really hard to compress the boot, be aware that we can compress the boot up to and including the carbon ring. Plenty of room. The problem is that, when we push the stainless ring to compress the boot, it brings the driveshaft with it. The driveshaft slides in the PTO easily, despite apparently not having any grease since who-know-when. (Remember, the boot on the PTO end tore off. Replacing that is why we need to remove the driveshaft in the first place.) The driveshaft is not seized in the impeller end, either. We can TURN the driveshaft independently of the floating ring, but the ring will not move backward without bringing the driveshaft with it. We have done this with the pump on to limit the driveshaft's movement, and we have taken the pump off and just pulled real hard.

So any suggestions on how to get the driveshaft out if the floating ring will not push back without pulling the driveshaft with it? Also remember: This boat flew the last time it was on the water. We just happened to notice the torn PTO boot in the engine compartment and set out to replace the boot (and fill it with grease) before we take the boat out again. Replacing the boot seems straightforward enough, but we can't do it until we get the driveshaft out. Which should not be this hard.