RESTO Two new X-4 restoration projects

[Minnetonka4me]

This has turned into the holy grail of 95 XP 800 threads! I had never seen that magazine picture before! You are absolutely spot on with the back of that hull!

Looking further than that...the hump part of the seat has a slightly different profile and the logo is much larger than production.

The funny thing with that is I found a buddy a NOS 95 seat cover for his and I thought it fit a little funny and the logo was larger. Well now I know why!!

Picture from the Sortie a few years ago when I still owned that mint Explorer...

 

[Minnetonka4me]

Also...look at the handlebars! It looks to have a JSG rigid bar cover kit on it! It has a custom center pad....crazy!

 

[AdamXP800]

Now the hunt is on for someone to actually find one of these


Long live the 2 stroke Seadoo!

 

[racerxxx]

Also...look at the handlebars! It looks to have a JSG rigid bar cover kit on it! It has a custom center pad....crazy!

I did see that but forgot to post it. Now you may be aware of this but for those who are not ( and most could probably care less). I notice that other than the water control valve being different the water box to outlet hose is different. It's shorter and lower to the VTS housing. The WCV also appears to be built from a RAVE housing by looking at the outside of it, I have not popped the cap yet to check but if it is that's pretty cool.

As far as the seat logo, I think that was the way with all the yellow seat covers. On my clapped out thread page 13--see below I posted a 95 800 and that seat has a big logo where my 99 SPX seat is a tad smaller. Manolocross will have to measure his logo on his yellow hump seat to get the actual sizing to see how it compares to the 99 SPX.

 

[racerxxx]

Subscribed!!!!! Congrats racer on the pick up! Now let's see what the inside looks like!!!

Alrighty........ First is the 95. It's pretty clean inside but once gutted it will be cleaner. All the electronics look clean someone had made some previous repairs in the rear ebox but did a solid job by soldering and shrink tubing. I'll also say that I know these hulls are "supposed" to be lighter but by looking at the deck in the same light as the 96, it is more transparent than the 96, so it could be a few layers short. The 95 also has the oil injection nipples on the top of the rotary valve cover, confirmed it through the 95 microfiche too. There are 4 head bolts that didn't snap or if you want to count it by the snapped ones, 8. There also is 2 snapped exhaust manifold bolts. Thankfully we have a fixture to hold the cylinder to drill out the exhaust bolts and we have CAD'd the head bolt locations so all we need to do is put it in the mill and indicate the cylinder bore and move out from the center to the holes and drill the snapped screws out, easy peasy.

95 only Water control valve, looking closer at it it's not like the ones on the engine.

95 short exhaust hose (compare it to the 96 down below)

Now to the 96. The engine looks mint(just light dirt) and has never been touched, but I found a huge issue with it. Mashenden had mentioned it was low on compression on the front cylinder in his thread so I knew I was going to be into it for something. I did a quick once over on the skis when I went to look at them at his place as I'm not overly concerned on this or that since the entire ski is going to be gone through as compared to guys going out to buy runners. So I'll just let the pics do the talking. I'm not upset with Mash at all, I knew I was buying 2 non running skis.

This is the 96 exhaust hose, much taller than the 95.

Now, where does this belong..................... DOH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Gonna have to see if we can fix this one up. The bitch is I just had a MINT set of 787 cases that I bought on ebay, that I returned because they were not the ones advertised. The ones advertised had the 787X tag on it so I just hit the buy it now button and when I got them they were just standard 787 cases. I was more into the X tag than the cases. One of my other 95 XP 800 hulls was an X engined ski, guy parted it and had said it was all original, he left the two pistons in the hull and they were the first over OEM's. So I was trying to "gather" parts to build an X engine (and try and track down the correct cylinders) later. Anyhow, I returned them, now I wish I didn't since they were mint. I can see the counter balance gear and the teeth are smoked and it spins on the shaft so I know the gear on the crank is wasted too.

 

[racerxxx]

Filled with the Best Stuff on Earth!

 

[Matt Braley]

The 95 is made from a different type of fiberglass that is lighter. There is a more aggressive timing curve in that CDI. The cylinder porting is different(better). I remember that part is in the 96 Racing Manual.

I see that bug back there. Man I had 40 different Volkswagen's before I was 20.

 

[CReynoldsMIZ]

Your hx is about a slight breeze away from denting the bug!

 

[racerxxx]

Your hx is about a slight breeze away from denting the bug!

Yeah, it's way to close for comfort, but I know it's not gonna tip anymore. I have about 2" clearance on the end of the handle bar end, oddly I feel safer now then when people walk near it at a car show.

 

[racerxxx]

Just posting some other differences in the 95 787 cases and internals.


Here is the 95 Case, there are no "eye brows" on the bottom of the intake ports. The second pic is my 96 787.

Now for the cranks. The PTO threads are supposed to be different on the 95 crank vs. the 96+ 787's and also the teeth on the counter balance gears are different on the 95 787 vs. the 96+ 787's. Again the second pic is my 96 787 crank.

96 Counter balance gears

95 787 Counter Balance gears

 

[Matt Braley]

Hmm. I just looked at my 95 800 case and it does have the eye brows. Someone had been in there before so there is a chance that parts are swapped around.

I'm loving the big pics. What kind of condition are you finding those bearings in?

 

[racerxxx]

Hmm. I just looked at my 95 800 case and it does have the eye brows. Someone had been in there before so there is a chance that parts are swapped around.

I'm loving the big pics. What kind of condition are you finding those bearings in?

I know this ski has never been apart (other than the head that Mashenden removed), the starter has never been removed. I really just want to document what I'm finding so hopefully the next guy who gets one can compare what he has. There is a bit of "mystery" to these 95's that draws me towards them. The more I take apart on this ski leads me to believe it is a pretty low hour ski that was severely neglected. It has at least had the fuel tank upgrade done (verified that and ordered two new replacement tanks for another 95 720 ski and the 96 XP ski), so that is taken care of. I do have another new tank in inventory that will go in here to make this minty fresh.

As far as the bearings, I find they roll, but not so nice. This is where my hang up is, I want to find a set of OEM rods and get all OEM bearings and have the crank rebuilt so I can keep the engine all 95 the way it came--if possible. The previous owner totally ran the wrong oil in this ski, the pistons, crank and cases are coated with tacky oil that is like baked on in a sense. The pistons are so tacky on the sides I can practically put my hand palm down towards the ground and stick a piston to it, yet oddly the raves look really clean with minimal oil, and I'm sure they never cleaned them. If you look at the RV surface you can see how dark the aluminum is, I already wiped it with lacquer thinner quickly so you could at least see the surface. Thankfully the Mag housing is like brand new looking, almost not a spec of dust in there until I popped it open after snapping all but 4 of the screws that hold the cover on. On the plus side the electronics do work (Beep Beep) and the info gauge works and I turned the engine over by the starter, after I un seized the engine which I think was that tacky oil holding it to the cylinders. It's just a shame they left it and neglected it.

 

[rotaxrule1]

Yeah they had the trim gauge in the hood and the info gauge by the DESS post. I would probably put the info gauge down low like the 95 800 and put the tach up top where you don't have to look down so far to see it.

Yeah that's what I was kinda thinking, it will be more work initially with re routing wiring, but probably be better in the long run. Nice find on those!

 

[TheMachin0]

are the oil injectors on opposite sides of the intake my 96 intake injects from the bottom the 95 from the top also the crank cases are diff the same as yours

 

[73Diesel]

Here's a question for everyone then. Since your RV cover has oil injection nipples and is an unmolested ski. The 95 I picked up last summer and am still restoring doesn't have any nipples at all, nor any holes that have been filled in and its a stock Rotax cover. Is that possible?

 

[TheMachin0]

are you sure its a stock intake is the oil pump gone also

 

[73Diesel]

Yes. The oil pump and shaft were also gone. There is a place in the front cover for the pump to go but the rotary valve cover doesn't have the brass nipples in it. Maybe an aftermarket one but it does say Rotax.

 

[Minnetonka4me]

I think it may have been a "R" (racing dept) part. I have had one of those manifolds too at one point.

I have yet to find a X motor so maybe the X motor was setup as premix maybe?

 

[73Diesel]

My motor is isn't a X motor. Wish it was though. But maybe there was some factory premix parts, I couldn't say.

 

[racerxxx]

are the oil injectors on opposite sides of the intake my 96 intake injects from the bottom the 95 from the top also the crank cases are diff the same as yours

Yes, the 96+ 800 0have the injection on the bottom, 95 800 on the top. I'll assume that you meant that your cases are DEFF(definitely) the same as my 95 cases. If so then that could be a distinguishing feature on the 95 cases.


Here is the microfiche from the 95 XP 800 clearly showing the top entry.

 

[racerxxx]

Yes. The oil pump and shaft were also gone. There is a place in the front cover for the pump to go but the rotary valve cover doesn't have the brass nipples in it. Maybe an aftermarket one but it does say Rotax.

Check for any part numbers cast into it.

I think it may have been a "R" (racing dept) part. I have had one of those manifolds too at one point.

I have yet to find a X motor so maybe the X motor was setup as premix maybe?

I still kick myself for not snagging the X engine that [MENTION=43106]CReynoldsMIZ[/MENTION] had out of a 96 GSX. I would have torn that down and mapped the ports on the cylinders. I want to find out exactly what the difference is other than the bore, or is it just the bore that makes it an X. I like where this stuff is going, I like concrete info as in measurements and pics of differences, numbers are real world data. Keep it coming.

 

[Matt Braley]

Yes the X engine is bored to be over 785cc. This is was where the cut off was for racing. Regular 95 XP800's (about 1500 made) were the usual 782cc.

The model with the X engine was over 785cc allowing it to compete against the big triples that Yamaha, Kawasaki and Polaris had. 500 X models were made and sold. This made it an official production model so it would be legal to race.

 

[racerxxx]

Yes the X engine is bored to be over 785cc. This is was where the cut off was for racing. Regular 95 XP800's (about 1500 made) were the usual 782cc.

The model with the X engine was over 785cc allowing it to compete against the big triples that Yamaha, Kawasaki and Polaris had. 500 X models were made and sold. This made it an official production model so it would be legal to race.

Yes, I agree with what you're saying it all make sense. But what I just don't get is Ski-Doo makes limited production sleds (500 as well) and they never have made one that shares the same decals as the standard version--it always has he X on it. Just wish the H20 guys at BRP would have followed company procedure, it would have been nice to see XP800x on the X engine skis. I'd also love to get some documentation from Sea-Doo or at least a birth certificate for the ski stating the engine serial # etc.... I know most guys could care less about that stuff but being a car guy I love documentation on cars, heck even a original sales brochure would be rad!

 

[Minnetonka4me]

Racer (Dan right??) if you want to send the MPEM to me Ill check the serial and engine serial numbers stored.

They dont always have it in there, and maybe someone had to replace it, but its always possible I can verify if a boat has its original motor.

 

[TheMachin0]

I build one motor out of the two. I used the crank and case from the 95. top end intake stator/cover carbs grey box and water box out of the 96. only differences I have found was the eyebrows intake nonbroke water box and the drive line. also from my experience the 95 720/800 with pump extentions are far superior than the shorty s but who couldn't use 3 more inches lol