Removing a stripped allen bolt - How do you do it?

[scrisp]

Okay, so I took 3 of the 4 allen bolts out of the carbs on my XP, but the 4th one won't budge. That's typical.

The bolt broke loose from the block, as the carb wants to turn, but the bolt was partly stripped before I started and now it's worse. The bolt seems as though it is seized in the carb body, just like the others were, just a lot worse.

What do you use to get the hex out of there? I looked at some DIY sites and they all talk about smacking a larger torx bit into the bolt and taking it out that way, but they don't say what to do when you don't have room to get a hammer in there. I also saw a lot of people who said that extractors don't work very well.

Don't want to heat is, with all of the gas around, so I'm kind of at a loss as to how to get it out.

I sprayed PB Blaster on the area, but doubt that will do much. The bolts have the white powdery compound on them, which seems to be making things worse, it's as if the bolts corroded.

 

[manolocross]

Holy crap edited... I thought it was a carb body screw!

 

[LouDoo]

Are you saying the bolt is seized to the carb. body and it also broke off at the block? Actually the bolt doesn't go into the block it attaches to the intake manifold/rotary valve cover which attaches to the block.

Go ahead and remove the carbs. if you can, remove the intake manifold (4 bolts) and get the manifold on your bench where you can work on it. If you absolutely can't get the bolt out you may need a intake manifold, minnetonka4me should have one.

http://fiche.seadoowarehouse.com/se...opwc&a=269&b=3&c=0&d=-CRANKCASE,-ROTARY-VALVE

Lou

 

[scrisp]

Oops, sorry guys, it is not "broken" as in snapped off, I mean that is was unscrewing. And yes, I meant to say from the manifold and not the block. lol

Basically, if I had room and could get the linkages off both carbs, I could spin the carb itsself and the bolt would come right out. It won't spin in the carb body, it's seized in there.

The choke cable is stall attached to both carbs, how does this, and the carb linkage unscrew? I see the little holder, for lack of a better word, that the cable slides through on the carb, does this have a set screw that hold the cable and adjust it? That's how my lawnmower is, and i figured that this was probably the same way, except that there is either crud making it so that I can't see the screw, or the screw is underneath. Either way, I need to get that and the synch linkage, then I'll have more room. The carb linkage seems like it just presses on from the diagram, I don't see a screw to hold it on the ball, but don't want to break it trying to pry it off.

 

[LouDoo]

The choke cable attaches to the linkage with a couple of small allen screws.

The throttle and oil pump cables attach kinda line the handbrake cables on a bicycle, release the tension on the cable and the fitting will come out.

You might want to download a service manual, it shows how to do this in the manual.

Lou

 

[Spimothy Leary]

have you tried maybe some needle nose vice grips on the head of the screw to spin it ?

carb linkage pops off, just give it a little tug i happen to have some carbs in a box so I took a pic, you'll see that there's no screw holding the linkage on, it just pops over the little nipples/nobs... they're probably more like nobs, but I like to say nipples....





but lou is right, first about the tension, just spin it down and you'll see that the end of the cable slides right now (again see pic #2 above) it might help but a schematic would be even better...

lou is also right about the manual, google it you'll see details...

once you get these off, what are your plans then ?

 

[CReynoldsMIZ]

Try using a hex bit to get it out. On my carbs I stripped out the head where it wouldn't work with a torx bit, but I found a hex bit socket that fit a little snigger and it came right out where it would only spin with the torx bit

 

[Robj]

Try using a hex bit to get it out. On my carbs I stripped out the head where it wouldn't work with a torx bit, but I found a hex bit socket that fit a little snigger and it came right out where it would only spin with the torx bit

I think you got that bass ackwards. He probably meant try jamming in a torx bit see if that works.

 

[scrisp]

lol

I tried it again just now and the hex is completely stripped. I'm off to Kmart or someplace to see if they have a Torx that I can tap into it, and I'll get an extractor just in case.

I tried getting vise grips on it, but there isn't room. The bolt that I'm having the problem with is the MAG carb, top bolt (it's more towards the center of the two carbs)

 

[racerxxx]

I sprayed PB Blaster on the area, but doubt that will do much. The bolts have the white powdery compound on them, which seems to be making things worse, it's as if the bolts corroded.

Keep spraying, you need to turn the powder into liquid. Best thing to do is to try and tighten it back down, basically to unwedge the screw and allow the blaster to soak down--keep spraying. You can't rush it or you'll jack it all up. Just work it so you can get the screw to spin, once the carbs are out you can drive the screw out from the other side CAREFULLY. When putting it back together get a round wire brush to clean the holes up in the carb then load the body of the screw with grease to help prevent the electrolysis of the stainless and aluminum from happening again. Patience and spray. [MENTION=51350]Jetskigoodies[/MENTION] sells hardware kits for the carbs and also has the correct length mounting screws.

 

[Spimothy Leary]

lol

I tried it again just now and the hex is completely stripped. I'm off to Kmart or someplace to see if they have a Torx that I can tap into it, and I'll get an extractor just in case.

I tried getting vise grips on it, but there isn't room. The bolt that I'm having the problem with is the MAG carb, top bolt (it's more towards the center of the two carbs)

needlenose vice ?

remove the pto carb to make room ?

 

[scrisp]

I don;t have any needlenose visr grips, but may have to go get some.

The PTO carb is off.

I tried taking the exhaust manifold off to make room to spin the carb loose so that i can take the bolt out another way on the bench, but alas, Seadoo apparently doesn't believe in using anti-seize compound on anything, but certainly don't mind putting an inch of paint everywhere.

I now have the intake manifold bolts almost out, but wondering, when I pop the manifold off, is anything to do with the rotary valve assembly going to pop out too? I have a shop manual, and it is very vague as to this.

 

[LouDoo]

Nothing is going to pop out when you remove the intake manifold/rv cover. Is the bolt loose at all? Do you have room to slip a hacksaw blade between the carb. and the bolt? Also you might try just a little heat, like a hair dryer with the PB Blaster. If you try this take the ski outside or to a well ventilated area.

Lou

 

[scrisp]

Well, I finally got it off. The bolt was soooooo stuck in there, I wasn't sure if it was ever going to come out. I took the rotary valve cover off, which was surprisingly easy and just used the carb itself to unscrew the bolt out of the manifold. Once I got the carb loose, I had to put the end of the bolt in a vise and wiggle the carb back and forth, while spraying it with PB blaster. There was a lot of that powdery white crud, and I spun the carb a few times and then tapped the bolt with a hammer until it came out of the carb body. I have a wire brush that looks like a pipe cleaner, I ran that through the holes in the carb body and thought that I'd never get all of the white powder out of there, but it's much better now.

The only thing that I have an issue with now is the big O ring that goes with the rotary valve cover, it's as if it is about 1/4" too long now, not sure exactly what happened there. lol

On a side note, I popped the MAG carb open to see if the filter looked clogged. OMG, it's a wonder the engine would even start!! It was filled with black crud. I put it back together and am going to send it to Dr Honda for a rebuild, it's beyond my skill level.

Thanks everyone, for the help, this was my first major mechanical project, and I haven't worked on a 2 cycle engine since I was in high school in 1981.

 

[Seadoobuddy]

If the filter was that clogged up, lets hope it wasn't making the motor run lean.

what made you think to remove the carbs in the first place.....bogging down, or just not running right.
Good thing you checked.
Tony is great with carbs, he went through mine last summer and it's running the best it ever has in the 6 yrs I've owned it.

 

[scrisp]

When I picked it up last fall, it would idle fine and the compression is just above 150 on both cylinders. When I put it in the water the first time, it ran fine until it got to about 1/4 throttle and it would bog down to where it almost quit. It would go right back to idling and I brought I back to the dock and winterized it.

A few weeks ago, I changed out the fuel lines and tried it again, it still ran the same way at the lake, so I decided to have the carbs done.

When I took the carbs off, they had what looked like orange jello dripping out of them. The gas had jelled into sludge, so I'm going to take the tank out and clean it while I'm waiting on the carbs, I don't want to messed them up right from the get-go when they come back. The previous owner said that they had drained the gas tank and it sat for 3 years without being ran, but they had left about 6 or 7 gallons in the tank. It was kinda dark when I put gas in it last fall and didn't see that it already had gas in it, so I guess that's what I get for relying on what the seller said. lol I only paid $500 for it and the trailer, so I figured that if worst came to worst, I could always resell it.

I'm all geeked about getting it beck to running though, I've never ridden an XP before, but everyone tells me that compared to my 95 SPX, it will be like the difference between a Chevette and a Corvette.

 

[Jetskigoodies]

Take the seadoo to your local dealer. The gas tank has a recall. They will swap it out for a brand new one. You can call brp directly and give them your hin number and they will tell you if it has already been done. I would just take your registration to the dealer and they will look it up. I go to K&W on auburn and ryan. They will usually have it done in about a week.

 

[Spimothy Leary]

i'd be interested in seeing pic's of the carbs. no heavy rust I hope.

 

[scrisp]

Take the seadoo to your local dealer. The gas tank has a recall. They will swap it out for a brand new one. You can call brp directly and give them your hin number and they will tell you if it has already been done. I would just take your registration to the dealer and they will look it up. I go to K&W on auburn and ryan. They will usually have it done in about a week.

I called BRP a month or so ago with the numbers and the rep said that my XP had already been done, but my SPX hasn't, that figures. lol Will the tank come out through the hatch opening? It looks like it might, but can't tell for sure.

 

[scrisp]

i'd be interested in seeing pic's of the carbs. no heavy rust I hope.

I'll get some pics later. There is no rust on the outside whatsoever. When I opened it up, there was none that I saw, but I just took it apart enough to get to the fuel filter inside.

What kind of paint should I paint them with when I get them back? The paint on there now is really thick and just started flaking off as I handled them.

 

[scrisp]

i'd be interested in seeing pic's of the carbs. no heavy rust I hope.

Here's both carbs as best that I can photograph them. They looks like that have scaling, but neither has a lot, just a bit that I'll cleanup when they come back. They both have some sort of grease all over them that makes it looks like the paint is crackled.

I ordered the base gaskets, Rotary Valve Cover O-ring, and carb mount screws today, they should be here in a week or so.

 

[Spimothy Leary]

those don't look bad at all, I wouldn't even bother painting them, especially if you have the stock airbox. If you had some prok's on them and your real anal about looks, sure,, but otherwise.. don't worry about it.