Cleaning carbs

[JJinSC]

Having finished replacing all of my grey fuel lines, I am thinking about pulling the carbs on my own tomorrow to clean them. I have always had a fear of messing with carbs so I was considering getting this done by a professional or a dealer. However, due to a mistake I made last week on my chainsaw, I ended up having to take the carb off of it and taking it apart and cleaning it. This thing looked alot like the pictures I have seen on this forum for our carbs, just miniature version. I was able to do it with no problems and without tearing the bladders or seals/gaskets. I figure things happen for a reason and this situation was to show me that I can do this.

So before I start, I wanted to get an idea on one thing. Can you really pull these carbs and clean them without disconnectioning the throttle,choke and oil injector cables?

 

[timmyboy76]

nope....but aint the tuff to re-install. Try not moving the "outer" jam nut on any of the cables, so it'll be "real close" to original settings, prior to removal.

 

[JJinSC]

I am really nervous about this as the linkages and adjustment screws are underneath the silencer box and I am not going to be able to see how to do any of this. Synchronizing carbs and all. I will have to do this stuff I have never done before by feel. I do not know man. Starting to hesitate again.

 

[timmyboy76]

mmmmeeeelllllloooooowwwwwwwwwww

:chillpill:, homey...pull cover off airbox, and remove the 6 allen bolts, inside, then undo bolts secur'n the carb holder plate, then pull airbox off. Lot easier once you "see" down there...nuth'n to it.

 

[JJinSC]

Yeah, I am ok with the removal, taking apart, cleaning and putting it back together. It is the reconnecting the cables, adjustments, synchronizing, tuning, etc. that has me unchilled.

 

[timmyboy76]

cant screw the "sync" up, if you dont mess with the linkage arm. For cables, ok, tab a silicone behind the one jam nut, so it cant move, then undo, snorkel the cable over butterfly/s, then remove. Let lay there, clean carbs, and re-attach.:cheers:

 

[JJinSC]

You make it sound so easy. Now my hesitation is reversing again. I am :chillpill:ing .

Let me get your advise on this. It is a 97 xp. I am the original owner. I ride a lot. High hours on my xp, but I have taken very good care of it. I have winterized it. Used fuel stabilizer ever year. I have just replaced the fuel lines. They all looked very cleaned as well as the fuel selector. There was some green goo starting to ooz out where the fuel lines attach to the metal nipples on the carbs, but did not appear to be any inside of the nipples.

The xp runs great with the exception of taking about 10 seconds to start when cold and it wants to bog with hesitation going between low rpms and high rpms. I have to feather the throttle to get by the hesitation. This sounds like maybe the check valves in the accelerator pumps are dirty. It idles great and runs high rpms great.

Given this information even in regards to the age, should I just clean or should I go ahead and buy a kit and clean/rebuild??

 

[timmyboy76]

Trust me bud...you'll grin at this thread, after you tackle it. From sounds of it, you never gave the carbs a chance, to allow crap to settle, so with that, I'd pull'm and clean them ony, scratch'n at the calcium that might have buuilt up on the diaphrams and o-rings. Other than that, you'd be cool.

 

[JJinSC]

Ok, I almost have the carbs completely off now. Just have a question in regards to these tiny grey fuel lines that run between the carbs. I think they are for the accelerator pumps? Anyways, I know I need to take these loose while cleaning. They have those crimp style clamps on them. What should I use to reattach them? Looks too small for hose clamps.

 

[timmyboy76]

good jub, stud...I use little zip ties.

 

[JJinSC]

Got 'em off. That wasn't hard at all. I went ahead and removed the brackets that all the cables connect to from the carbs, and I was able to remove them without messing with any adjustments.

Just regular wire ties, huh? Not any special kind?? The heat won't bother ties??

Also, I hit the throttles and only the accelerator pump nozzle in the pto carb sprayed. This was of course after I had pulled the feed and return lines. It looks like the check valve is right at the pump itself (inline) and then the two little fuel lines split off to each carb. So since one is spraying, that would mean the check valve is ok, right?? What would cause one to spray and not the other?

 

[timmyboy76]

clogged brass fitting inside the throat of carb. If carb cleaner/compressed air, wont clear it, the nI use a bic lighter, heat it up, then blast the fitting...:cheers:

 

[JJinSC]

Yep, couldn't blow through it. WD-40 would not even go through it, so I put the carb cleaner through it once I got it all apart and that cleared it right up. I am pretty sure that was the culprit of my hesitation as the rest of the carb has been really clean. There was a little dirt in the carb filters, so I got them all cleaned out.

So I got the Mag carb all cleaned and back together and started working on the PTO carb. I can't get the screws to break loose on the regulator block. Also having trouble getting two of the screws on the pump side of that carb to break loose. I went to lowes to find one of those punch tools (the one you tap with a hammer) for breaking it loose and they did not have any. Any ideas on getting these screws broken loose or where I could get one of those tools?

 

[JJinSC]

Oops. I think I accidentally got onto some else's thread when I made this response when I meant to make it here....

The impact screwdriver worked like a dream. I got them all cleaned reassembled. I am interconnecting them now and getting ready to reinstall.

I have two questions. 1) I did not change the main pulse line when I changed all my other lines because it was not a grey line. It is black and is preformed to a certain shape. upon inspection, I noticed a small crack running lengthwise on top of the curve. I was wondering if I needed to order a new replacement or just replace it with regular fuel injector line?

2) The manual says LSA should be at 1 turn for my model. Before I removed them I checked to see how many turns to bottom and they were both at 2 turns. Should I put them back at 2 turns or should I set it to 1 turn??

 

[timmyboy76]

1) Yea, regular 1/4in fuel line

2) 1-3/4 for low, 0 for high

Way to go, stud.:cheers:

 

[JJinSC]

Ok, Completion. :hurray: I got everything back together and installed and had no parts left over. That's a good sign, huh? Turned on the fuel. and it fired up with the first crank after it turned long enough to get fuel back through it. :hurray: Checked for leaks, etc. Everything looked good, so I took 'er to the landing. Put 'er in and had a good evening of fun on the river. :cheers:

After trying it out I have good news and bad news. The good news it runs better than it did in regards to the hesitation and throttle response. The bad news is that it still does not run like it should. I do not have to feather the throttle any more, but it does hesitate (no longer bogs) when going from idle to higher rpms when you first crank it after it has been cutoff. Very small hesitation. What could be causing this? I know I was very meticulous at doing this cleaning and I know everything is very clean now. Could it be because I put the LSA's back to where they were? I didn't get your message about 1 3/4 until after I got back from the river. I can move down 1/4 turn. Or could it be the spark plugs? I just changed them a couple weeks ago, but that was before the carb cleaning. I did not mess with the accelerator pump itself as I saw it spray gas through the nozzles before the cleaning. As I think about this, it seems like it has always had this hesitation since about the 2nd or 3rd season I have had it. Any thoughts??

 

[captain scale]

Are you sure that the hesitation is not due to a worn out wear ring un the jet pump?

 

[JJinSC]

Well now that the bogging is gone, I definately have more cavitation than I have had before, but cavitation is not the hestitation I am talking about this is a hesitation in the motor. Like it is doesn't want to take the throttle, but then it takes it and goes.

 

[timmyboy76]

clip the plug wires, install new plugs, and reset LSA to what posted above...:cheers:

 

[JJinSC]

I'll give that a try. I was thinking about the clipping of the wires too. I have never done that before. Thanks for all your help and encouragement. I had another great ride today and it is definitely running close to perfect now. I'll clip the wires and put new plugs in this week. I'll bet it will run like new after that.

Thanks again.:cheers:

For those of you contemplating doing the carbs but are a little weary, if you are mechanically inclined at all, just do it. Take your time. Pay attention and make notes. It's not that bad.

 

[bigler]

i will be doing this eventually some day. almost did it on my old gsx before it got destroyed. this is good news for the mechanically handicapped!:cheers:

 

[bond67]

I'll give that a try. I was thinking about the clipping of the wires too. I have never done that before. Thanks for all your help and encouragement. I had another great ride today and it is definitely running close to perfect now. I'll clip the wires and put new plugs in this week. I'll bet it will run like new after that.

Thanks again.:cheers:

For those of you contemplating doing the carbs but are a little weary, if you are mechanically inclined at all, just do it. Take your time. Pay attention and make notes. It's not that bad.

just curious hows the seadoo running now?

 

[JJinSC]

It's running great except for a little hesitation when going from idle to higher RPMs when first cranked or after idling for a few seconds. I still have to clip the plug wires, install new plugs, and reset LSA as Timmyboy suggested. I just haven't had time to get it off the lift and on the trailer yet. You know, every time I go to take it off the lift I end up going for a ride . I plan on doing it tomorrow at the same time I change my oil filter.

 

[cbrownstone8]

sorry posted at the end of discussion, problem was already solved, still learning this procedure

 

[JJinSC]

Ok, I finally got a day off and took the doo off the lift and trailered it so that I could do some work. Changed the oil filter, Clipped the plug wires back 1/4 inch, installed new properly gapped spark plugs, adjusted my lsa back from 2 turns to 1 3/4 like Timmyboy recommended. While I was in there, I took the airbox off and removed the flame arrestor and peeked to see if the accelerator pump nozzles were spraying like they should when I pumped the throttle. I found that again, like when I took the carbs apart to clean that the nozzle in the MAG carb was not spraying. I pulled the little fuel line off of it and gave it a couple of short burst of carb cleaner and then compressed air. I could now here the compressed air coming through the nozzle. I reattached the fuel line and tried again. No spray. I though to myself, either the fuel line between the T and this nozzle is clogged or the T could be clogged because the other nozzle is spraying fine. I checked the other nozzle and it was now not spraying. I figured I had pumped enough times to use all the fuel in the line so I cranked the ski up and it first wanted to hesitate when I gunned the throttle, but then it stopped the hesitation. I cut it off, removed the arrestor again and looked. Gas was now spraying from both nozzles. I headed for the landing. It now fires up like lightning, no hesitation at all, so I rode it for about 20 minutes. No hesitation between low and high RPMs. I head back to the dock and dock for a while, while I drink some refreshments. After about 15 minutes, I cranked it up again and the hesitation was back. Sort of like the accelerator pump is loosing prime, because once I feather the throttle and get it going, It does not hesitate any more between the lower and upper RPMs unless I cut it back off for a few minutes. This thing runs like new again except for the fumble on the 1st move from lower RPMs.

So my thoughts are this..

1) Check valve inline to the two nozzles in the carbs is not working 100% and letting gas seep back down into the carbs.

2) Accelerator pump needs cleaning. Not much to it though. Can this be the problem?

3) I may need to back the LSA a little further back. Maybe to 1 or 1/2 (manual says 1 turn) . I am not sure about this one as I am no carb expert and do not really know what the LSA does other than tune for a smooth idle.

Any thoughts or something I haven't thought of????