Changing wear ring in 96 Seadoo Challenger

[mike_tyler]

Hello all

I'm new to the forum and have had my 96 Challenger since 99. The boat is probably one of the nicest 1st gen Challengers you will ever see. It's always been covered and garaged and has very few hours on it. It's sat for last two years due to flooding in our area and lake closings. We've had it out twice this season and noticed some hesitation on takeoff. Also noticed it would cut out briefly at high speeds. I thought this would clear up with fresh fuel and problem persists so I plan to take into local Seadoo service center and let them go thru the carbs.

A new additional problem that occurred was what appears to be wear ring failure. UNsure what caused this but we noticed boat would cavitate around 15mph. We nursed it home and after a little research here found large chunks missing out of the wear ring. No apparent damage to the impeller and most all else looks like a very low hours propulsion system. I want to replace the wear ring myself before I take it in to the center for carb work. My questions are, what else should I replace while I have pump out? I know I need to replace the wear ring and the front neoprene seal. Maybe good to do the following

• check pump wear
• pump fluid
• replace rubber shaft seals

Anything else I am missing? I have the manual somewhere but was hoping you guys could comment on anything I missed, reassembly tips, etc

 

[Danosll]

i like to put my new wear ring in freezer overnight , that way it just slips right in. no need for a press or hammer. if you are removing impeller check your bearings, seal and shaft(remember these parts are probably 20 years old) .replace rubber bumpers use the correct oil, and do a pressurization test (10 PSI for 10 min). A shop manual is extremely useful for any DIY

 

[Coastiejoe]

Replace the ring with an OEM or Delrin. Anything else is a gamble.

 

[Danosll]

same applies to your carbs insist they use oem mikuni gaskets seals needle seat ect.

 

[mike_tyler]

Thanks for the responses, all good suggestions and appreciate the confirmation of Delrin wear rings as I had seen them while I was browsing eBay for parts. I try to use OEM when I can and can probably source the Mikuni kits myself and supply them to the shop. They quoted me about $50/ea in parts so maybe they use Mikuni's?

The oil in the pump is dark black and the smell reminds me of 90w hypoid oil like is used in automotive rear ends. No signs of contaminants, metal particles or leakage. The impeller has a slight bit of thrust movement, maybe .030" to .040" and little if any, radial wear. Seems to spin free and smooth as well. I saw a video on YouTube where a guy removed his wear ring with the impeller in place using the freezer method and was thinking on trying that.

 

[racerxxx]

Ok, I can see your a car guy. I see the bead blaster, your plum crazy, the 69/70 fastback avatar, etc...... you can rebuild these carbs.

 

[mike_tyler]

Yeah, the car is a 72 Plum Crazy Purple Cuda and behind me is my 70 Mach 1 Mustang. As good with automobile restorations as I am carburetors have always been a challenge. I have attempted carb rebuilds many times previous and rarely have been successful.

Just recently I had an Echo leaf blower with a carb problem. I took it apart, cleaned it with carb spray cleaner, blew out every orifice I could find and put an OEM kit in it only to find it behaved the same way. I laid down a whopping $35 for a new carb and Voila! She runs great now. Especially in a two stroke application, I have no problem paying to have this work done.

 

[snikwad003]

I wish 787 carbs were $35

 

[mike_tyler]

Agreed. I am not big on China quality but you can pickup new knock-off carbs for that gummed up Ryobi weed eater for <$10 that work suprisingly well. Beats $35-65 the shop will charge to rebuild or repair your equipment.

Freezer trick didn't work, and after I thought about it I'm not surprised. The wear ring should shrink but the housing probably shrinks as well. Any attempt to get movement from the fragged out wear ring resulted in chipping like glass. The cold state left it very brittle. Looks like I will be removing impeller after all.

 

[Danosll]

probably just as well after 20 years it wouldnt hurt to take a look at bearings(replace any bearings'shaft or seal that is questionable). impellers are put on with loctite red(271) and require a little heat to break free. and believe me the freezer method for INSTALLATION is the best. you can even put housing in warm oven or direct sun while ring is in freezer. make sure thrust bearing is seated properly upon reinstallation . i think there is a newer antirattle spring and pusher for your cone. change oil seal seal and pressure test. use loctite red on impeller

 

[Danosll]

yours may not have the antirattle spring and pusher #44 #45 and i believe you will need to change cone as well#13(not 100% sure about cone but is is a different part#)

 

[mike_tyler]

Ok, I dont see it on the 96 parts layout. Starting to think I should just let the center do all of this work. What about carbion ring? Doe it play a critical role in thrust and propulsion or is it just a secondary seal to keep water out of the boat?

As a side note, does anyone know what the 1st gen Challengers sold for new off the show room floor in the late 90's?

 

[Danosll]

antirattle was added in 97. simple to do but much easier with manual. I believe they are available on this site. and you have the most knowledgeable people on this subject in the entire world right here on this site. at your disposal. .

 

[Danosll]

if your carbon ring is not excessivly worn most people here do a 180* turn if its a little oval.sometimes takes a little run time to reseat (might drip a bit of water till reseated). make sure the bellows still apply sufficent pressure to keep it tight against stainless hat. I think these parts have a decent reputation jobber. but if anybody on this forum disagrees with me please chime in.

 

[mike_tyler]

Ok, I will plow on then.Thanks for the note on this. Any advice on impeller removal tools? I see several on eBay and unsure on quality of the lower cost units.

 

[Danosll]

Ok, I will plow on then.Thanks for the note on this. Any advice on impeller removal tools? I see several on eBay and unsure on quality of the lower cost units.

The first couple of times i used an old driveshaft with a big pipe wrench. . i think i paid $14 for the one im useing now from sbt but i was ordering some parts anyway. Im sure you can source one locally. Or buy from site sponsers

 

[snikwad003]

Osd parts has the kit you need with antirattle cone, oil, seals, bearings, oem wear ring and tool for $130. You can get an oem impeller shaft for $88 from them too. I was in a pinch and bought a rebuilt pump with a knock off wear ring installed and after 3 weekends I heard the impeller rubbing on the ring when I cleared the water out of the exhaust after I put it on the trailer:cuss: , you want an oem ring, or derilin from what I read is just as good but i have never used one.

 

[mike_tyler]

Got my impeller tool today and as my luck goes, it doesn't fit. Is there a Seadoo tool number I should have referenced against to fit my 96 Challenger with stock impeller? This is the one I bought here and seems to be too big.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/281685793997

 

[Danosll]

The ad is wrong that is an impeller tool for Polaris #80-301-10


The Seadoo tool is part #80-101-10

or OEM # 295 000 001

 

[mike_tyler]

Thanks Dan, appreciate the fast response. I was able to get the wear ring out last night with impeller in place. It really was easy using a dremel tool and being careful not to go past the outer surface of the ring.

 

[Danosll]

I tried to reply last night but the site was down.They should change your tool as the ad was wrong. right part# wrong application

 

[mike_tyler]

Yes, they made good on it. Refunded pmt and told me to keep the tool

 

[hotrodssnova]

Don't put the whole pump in the freezer, just the wear ring it's self. Carbs really are very easy. Not much to them. There's a sticky on them also with a ton of info. Find it at the top of the page.

 

[mike_tyler]

Yeah, I think it's the wear rings in the larger pumps that can be removed by freezing.

https://youtu.be/I6qVJy1BLHY

I bought the OEM Mikuni kits and plan to try the carb rebuilds. Just need to get the pump back together now.

 

[mike_tyler]

I'm about to pull the trigger on the OSD wear ring kit, impeller boot, double lip seal for the pump housing and anti rattle kit. Would you know if my stock cone will accept the spring and pusher?