98 GTX LTD overheating... should I remove top of head? (solved)

[Grim]

No has nothing to do with engine temp.you have a feed line going in then a hose going to the mid pipe.it tunes the return pulse to the exhaust port opening and cools the pipe to make it think it's smaller for better top end flow.if it was my essed up you would be melting exhaust lines and the rubber coupler.

ok, so that won't solve my main issue...of fit over heating at higher RMPs....maybe its a clogged head.

 

[Grim]

Yes correct.i would pull the head and see what you got going on.i have never had a problem with leaking head gaskets

That's seems like the best plan, I'll work on that. Thanks for the advise. Just to verify, you didn't see real issue with the wear ring or propeller. Would those grooves cause any cavitation at higher RPMs. Is there a way to tell if I have cavitation by running it, a feel or sound?

 

[Poormanracing]

ok, so that won't solve my main issue...of fit over heating at higher RMPs....maybe its a clogged head.

The fitting going into the head is a 90 and the sensor is right there.i have had a ton of them get clogged with debris.weeds and algae are the main things I find.on a older machine I'd pull the head just to see what's going on

 

[Poormanracing]

That's seems like the best plan, I'll work on that. Thanks for the advise. Just to verify, you didn't see real issue with the wear ring or propeller. Would those grooves cause any cavitation at higher RPMs. Is there a way to tell if I have cavitation by running it, a feel or sound?

From a stand still or idling if you go wide open and it hits the rev limiter that's a sign.wide open it would be over revving or hitting a rev limiter.cavitation causes heat.on your impeller I don't see signs of heat.look at the trailing edge of the backside of the impeller and look for heat marks or minor rust pitting.

 

[Grim]

well dang, I ran it for about 15 secs to warm it up and removed the head, all looks well, pretty clean. My mom told me it only had about 30 hrs. on it. Here are some pics, does anyone see any issues? The white crumbs is just from the removal of the top, Ill clean that up before I put it all back together. The top of the pistons have a little bit of black crust on them. I am wondering if my dad used the wrong oil, he wasn't known for the details, he just did what he wanted. any way to clean that up safely?
One cylinder does seem to be darker/oiler than the other, same with the spark plug, any issues there?

So with the head passages being clear, my next brain storm is maybe the pipe has some restrictions that doesn't let water flow well out of the head. I have already checked water flow for the pipe, it looks good, all have good solid streams. It is suppose to come out forcefully or just a nice stream?

Any other ideas I'm all ears!

 

[Poormanracing]

Where the elbow comes in it is skimmed over.under there is where it gets clogged

 

[Grim]

Where the elbow comes in it is skimmed over.under there is where it gets clogged

I pulled the elbow yesterday and I found a very small piece of white crude, not sure that would be big enough to clog anything. I am also going to blow out the top of the head, I see some crude film .

 

[etemplet]

I didn't see where you pulled the head. LOL My advice was don't pull the head. If you have a couple of studs where the nut won't come off then you'll be pulling the cylinders too because you broke the head loose and you need to replace the gasket. It can become a can of worms quickly. Anyway glad it came off for you.

How is your block drain on the right side of the engine at the bottom?

If you think you water passages are clogged you might be able to use a radiator flush but I'd be careful with the aluminum. I'm sure they make products that are aluminum safe. If the engine is heating up water is not getting through or as @mikidymac says you have a pump issue. Good advice to pull the pump. Good Luck !!

 

[etemplet]

Did you check your compression before you pulled the head. I'd do the top end while I was there but that's just me.

 

[Poormanracing]

I pulled the elbow yesterday and I found a very small piece of white crude, not sure that would be big enough to clog anything. I am also going to blow out the top of the head, I see some crude film .

Can you get to the bottom of the temp sensor?

 

[Grim]

Can you get to the bottom of the temp sensor?

When I removed the head plate the sensor, is right there, maybe I'm not understanding the question.

 

[Grim]

Did you check your compression before you pulled the head. I'd do the top end while I was there but that's just me.

Yes one was right at 138 the other about 140

 

[Grim]

I didn't see where you pulled the head. LOL My advice was don't pull the head. If you have a couple of studs where the nut won't come off then you'll be pulling the cylinders too because you broke the head loose and you need to replace the gasket. It can become a can of worms quickly. Anyway glad it came off for you.

How is your block drain on the right side of the engine at the bottom?

If you think you water passages are clogged you might be able to use a radiator flush but I'd be careful with the aluminum. I'm sure they make products that are aluminum safe. If the engine is heating up water is not getting through or as @mikidymac says you have a pump issue. Good advice to pull the pump. Good Luck !!

As far as the block drain, I have seen water going through that hose, it is the dingy orange color so not easily visible. I haven't actually taken that hose off to check the flow, I missed that one, should I check it? What should the flow look like on that one. Looking at the pics it seems like the head area is pretty clear, the holes at the bottom are not clogged, so my only guess, if there was a clogged, that it is in the pipe or the intake to the exhaust. Or as you have mention its a pump problem..

 

[etemplet]

You have to check everything. There could be a restriction at any one point. The Drain at the bottom being restricted is a good reason for the engine to get hot. Also where that line goes out the back of the ski there is a fitting. It is real easy to connect that hose the a threaded stud cuz you can't see crap when you are reaching back there. I've fought that more than once. If everything was clear the engine shouldn't running hot. These skis are sneaky.

 

[Grim]

Any ideas on removing the black crude from the top of the piston, safely. Maybe use a non course brush and dap some grease remover?

 

[etemplet]

Leave that alone. It will just get in between the piston, cylinder walls, and the rings. Everything is happy right now... leave it be. There are additives you can mix in your fuel to help clean the engine but best thing is to just get the fueling correct and that will clean itself up. Good Luck !

 

[JC-SUPERJET]

The Piston "Black Top" gives more Compression

 

[Grim]

Got another question, I noticed there were o-rings on the long head bolts (one with nuts on them.) for the cylinder head I ordered some for it but I didn't find any on the bolts when I removed the cylinder head. Do they tend to get loose and drop down? Do they rot? Should I remove the bolts to see if they are further down and out of sight. I was just planning on cleaning the cylinder head plate and putting it back on without removing those bolts!

 

[Grim]

Ok, so I didn't notice anything that was bad/obstructing flow of the water when i took of the head. So i am going back to the beginning to make sure I have all the hoses connected to the right spot. I used the parts diagram to help me out. First picture is the flow. Green is for water coming in and red is for water going out. Am I on track here?

 

[Grim]

The second one is to track which way it flows into each port.
Flowing in:
= A to B and C
= B (into exhaust through motor)
= C to D (into exhaust)

Flowing out:
= E to F (out back of ski (pisser)
= G to H (out of back of ski (pisser)
= I to J and K (goes out back)
= L to M (out back of ski)

 

[Grim]

Well I got no help on the picture above but that is ok. I took her out today after everything was back together and she didn't overheat. Yay. Its crazy. I didn't do anything really but take the top off (head) and put it back on , with a new head gasket, and poof she is running good. Well mostly, got some carb tuning to do.

Thanks everyone for the advice and help, it got her back up and running.