'98 GS question

[f2shooter]

Evening all,

I started a thread on this ski but put it in the wrong place and it's been ignored after a few replies. I can understand that but still have a question and probably more than one by the time I am done. I got this '98 GS from my nephew but it has been in the family since it was new. It's been run nearly every season and well cared for. Some major changes for my nephew caused him to put it up for sale so now it is in my yard. It wasn't starting unless I put starting fluid in it and then wasn't moving fuel. I've put a Mikuni kit in the carb, replacing a missing part or two, and replaced the fuel filter. It fires right up and is pulling fuel through the filter but runs out the prime and stops. I finally noticed that while it isn't out of oil, the light is on so content is low. So the question is, does this engine have a safety cutoff for low oil situations? It would make sense as very bad things can happen when oil is not used. What kind of oil does it use? I know it is a special type but don't know any more about it. This came with no paperwork at all, no shop manual or instruction book so I am figuring it out as I go. Is there something I'm simply not seeing or a safety feature of some kind? I'd like to get this back in the water while there is some summer left.

Rick H.

 

[mikidymac]

No safety feature.
You need to replace any fuel lines that are grey. And I would replace the fuel selector and filter as they commonly leak air causing your symptoms. Also did you replace the needle and seat and did you change the carb spring?

For oil you have to use only API-TC oil absolutely no TCW oil. If the oil in it is blue or green it is 99.9% likely the wrong oil.

 

[Bills86e]

starving doo

I recommend BRP Mineral oil for your 717 motor. Yes, air leaking into the fuel supply line, but only if the Mag carb's fuel pump is not suctioning. We strongly suggest you change the two RV oil lines every two years, as these 3/32" id Tygon lines turn brittle and break, and if this happens the engine internals will not get lubrication. D/L a free manual specific to your '98 GS Seadoo.

 

[f2shooter]

The needle, seat and spring were replaced not long ago and I didn't replace them now. The accelerator pump cover had been removed and the diaphragm had not been re-installed. It simply wasn't there. I put a new kit in and made sure that part is where it should be. The fuel line is not the grey material, it is black. I'm familiar with tygon and how brittle it can get, I use it on a number of R/C airplane fuel systems. What is in it now seems soft and pliable, doesn't have that stiff brittle feel. The fuel filter is new. I doubt the fuel selector has ever been replaced, I did not realize it was a common failure part. Still, this is a nearly 20 year old ski so I can't complain. Nice to know it is a 717 engine, what does that designate? Displacement? As for oil, there is some puddled on the bottom, seems normal for this ski. It has a green tint to it but also has a little black oil in there. I suspect someone put the wrong oil in at some point. I knew there was a specific oil correct for this engine but couldn't recall what it was. I will download that manual, I'm a big believer in shop manuals for things like this. I spent a long time as an A&P mechanic where those manuals were a requirement. With any luck I'll get this thing running this season. There isn't that much to do though it is frigging hot in the garage and outdoors. Summer in the South as always.

Rick H.

 

[Mickirig1]

Did you check the pop off when you did carb? You can use the pop off tester to check fuel system for air leaks. The water separator/fuel filter under front hatch can be a problem. The gasket cracks or no longer seals. It is easier to suck air the gas. The bigger the air leak the less gas pressure you get.

 

[f2shooter]

The fuel filter is brand new so I am guessing it is in good shape. It doesn't seem to be leaking so I suspect it isn't sucking air either. It would be simple enough to replace though. Not sure what the pop off is or where to find it. Still very much learning my way around this system. It isn't terribly complex but it has its peculiarities.

Rick H.

 

[JJinSC]

Like has already been said, this is a fuel delivery issues. Once you download the manual I would recommend doing the fuel system pressure check first. That will tell you if you have a leak. Leaks can be present in these systems that will not drip fuel but will draw air once the vacuum is created. If no leaks found then check pop-off.

 

[Mickirig1]

The correct oil I use, will turn green when it leaks. I don't know if it is air that does it or the little bit of water in the bilge. It starts as normal colored oil.

 

[mikidymac]

The correct oil I use, will turn green when it leaks. I don't know if it is air that does it or the little bit of water in the bilge. It starts as normal colored oil.

What oil do you use? The only approved oil I have used is gold or red not green.

 

[Mickirig1]

It is clear, brown tinged. AMSOIL Interceptor oil. It turns green like I said. Starts brown / clear. I have poured enough quarts into the ski's.

 

[mikidymac]

Wow, that's weird. I serviced a friends 97' XP using it and didn't notice it. Good to know. The only actual green oil I have seen is the Maxima Marine Pro that is TCW-3.

 

[Mickirig1]

I thought it was weird! What the hell? It started clear/brown. It's hard to slide stuff by me. I noticed details and changes. Part of my mental makeup. Must be the Paramedic in Me!

 

[f2shooter]

Well this thing is about to get the best of me. I pulled the carb and checked everything, found that the cover that was originally loose had come slightly loose again. Actually the bolts were ever so slightly too long and had to be replaced with shorter bolts to tighten down that cover and diaphragm so that it doesn't leak air. After a thorough inspection I tried it again, still not drawing fuel. I blew air through the lines and they are clear, or at least air is moving all the way through. Question: There are three outlets/inlets on this carb. One is labeled puffer (I think that was it) and I get the impression it is some sort of pump line. It is short and goes to another inlet near the bottom of the carb. The other two are larger and next to each other and had fuel lines going to them Could I have connected these two improperly? I checked the fuel filter and it has fuel coming to it still. The separator appears to be in good shape, no apparent leaks or cracks. My next step is likely to be downloading the maintenance manual but if I don't figure out something in the next couple of weeks than it's going to get towed to a shop that supplied the carb kit to begin with. It's just too hot to be working on it instead of having some fun with it.

Rick H.

 

[JJinSC]

If this is a single carb machine, one nipple is the inlet. One nipple is the outlet and the other is for the pulse line that goes to the engine. Now I have never noticed one labeled "puffer" but logic would seem to indicate that should be your pulse line maybe.

 

[f2shooter]

Yeah puffer was a brain fart, the name of a sailboat I am considering. Sorry about that, it is marked 'Pulse'. I figured of the others, one is an inlet and the other an outlet or I am guessing a return line. Both go to the fuel tank. This is a single carb machine. I am guessing the line to the fuel filter is the inlet. Of those two, located above and below each other, which is which? I promise to learn all this and quit asking so many elementary questions but appreciate all the help offered to this point.

Rick H.

 

[Mickirig1]

There should be arrows on the top of the fuel line nipples for in and out. The other line is the pulse line that use positive and negative crankcase pressures from the piston movements to drive the fuel pump diaphragm. Pull choke and throttle wide open when you try to start. A little fuel in the air box helps too.

 

[f2shooter]

Well go figure!! I stepped away from this for a couple days and was actually considering towing to a shop and getting them to figure it out. The closest one though is 30 miles away and didn't answer the phone for three days! I went back to it this evening, checked all the lines, filter and fuel line routing. It would still run briefly if primed and then quite even doing that. I put two brand new plugs in it and for lack of a better idea I poured fuel into each line at the engine end of the line and then plugged it all back together. Finally it started and kept running. It was responsive to choke and throttle operations if a little bit slow to respond. I shut it down after less than maybe 90 seconds as I didn't have a water line attached. I realized then that I hadn't put the clamps on either fuel line and it may have been sucking a little air. Tomorrow I'll go over everything and see if I can find any other air leaks. I'll hook up a water line and try it again. If it continues to work properly I make take the bold action of towing it to the lake and seeing if it will actually go. I know this is all basic stuff and it isn't a complex system but it certainly has its moments.

Rick H.

 

[Mickirig1]

Take it to a lake and back it into the lake so the intake grate is under water. Leave it tied to the trailer and start it. Make sure it runs OK before you launch it. Most repair places will not touch Skis's older the 2005. Because the dudes that work there can not figure out what is wrong if the scanner does not give them a clue! This time of year good luck getting them to even look at it!

 

[f2shooter]

That's funny, most can't sort out a problem without a scanner. Sad but true I suspect. I finished putting all the air cleaner parts and so on back in place, made sure every line is clamped properly and started it again. It is running fine now, seems back to its old self though it hasn't left the yard yet. Not this weekend but next we plan to test run briefly once more and tow it to the lake. I'll try that test run in water and if it works we'll see about putting half hour or an hour on it. I'll pick up fresh oil and alcohol free gas and service it fully, have it ready to go. Everyone here has been very helpful and I appreciate it. I'll post results and a photo or two when we get it home.

Rick H.

 

[Bills86e]

Remember that Grease is your friend! Do your Ski & your trailor wheel bearings.

Wishing you a great summer! :seeya:

 

[f2shooter]

Wheel bearings I only had to learn once long ago. Learned a lot of colorful vocabulary then too. From my Dad. As I have no shop manual yet where does the Ski need to be greased? I'll look closely and it will probably be pretty clear but any hints....I picked up a quart of oil today from the Yamaha dealer that meets specs or at least that's what they said and it goes along with what I've read printed on the Ski. Bought a quart for use in a brief test run next weekend but found a Bombardier dealer 45 miles away that sells factory spec oil by the gallon. Same place I got my carb kit actually. I'll use that for any extended days on the water. How much gas and how much oil does one of these carry?

Rick H.