Steering / Alignment off while at speed

[mejim707]

Two things:

1: Alignment
I'm at a point where I'm not sure if there's a fix for this. I've adjusted my alignment at the pump and using a straight edge and measuring the distance to the hull on both sides. I have the alignment of the steering nozzle down to about 1/16 if that. It's pretty much dead on.

However, just cruising around the boat tracks almost perfectly straight with the wheel centered. But as soon as I give it the beans I have to hold the wheel about 1/8 turn to the left to keep it tracking straight. Of course, this changes my steering dynamic.

Is this normal? If I have the alignment dead on, is it normal to have to hold the wheel to the left to keep it straight while at speed?

2: Helm Adjustment Impossible
The adjustment post under the storage compartment in the helm has a lock nut to hold it in place. This lock nut will not remove! No matter what I do, it just spins as though it's turning the entire screw post inside the adjustment block. That lock nut needs to come off so I can adjust the block by spinning it on the threads but it's impossible to remove the lock nut.

Has this happened to anyone else? I'm thinking I'll need to get a bolt cutter to remove it.

 

[POPPS]

Can you post some pics?....generally on most seadoos you do NOT make the alignment at the pump...normally you want thread the hexagonal fitting on as far as it will go...for strength ...I learned this the hard way,,.the adjustment is done up front,,.you should not have to "cut" anything,,,so don't yet,,,give us some pics,,,

 

[mejim707]

Can you post some pics?....generally on most seadoos you do NOT make the alignment at the pump...normally you want thread the hexagonal fitting on as far as it will go...for strength ...I learned this the hard way,,.the adjustment is done up front,,.you should not have to "cut" anything,,,so don't yet,,,give us some pics,,,

Thanks POPPS! Here are a few pictures with explanations as to what is happening. I will absolutely tighten the Ball Joint at the pet pump to give it max strength as you suggest. But I still need to adjust the alignment and the only way to do that now will be at the helm, but currently this is impossible because the lock nut will not come off.

Maybe, and hopefully, I'm doing something wrong?

 

[POPPS]

Can you possibly give it some penetrating fluid and small cigarette torch lighter to heat it up..?
But that us the spot for the adjustment I believe.

 

[mejim707]

Can you possibly give it some penetrating fluid and small cigarette torch lighter to heat it up..?
But that us the spot for the adjustment I believe.

So the issue isn't that the nut won't turn, it turns fine. The issue is that the screw inside it is spinning with the nut. It's as though the screw inside the adjustment "block" broke free and now it just spins freely so turning the lock nut is not unscrewing it.

I think my only option is to get a nut cutter and cut that lock nut off there. I'll need to get a new adjustment block. That's fine with me so long as I can adjust the steering properly.

 

[POPPS]

Okay...I think I get it,,,go for it.

 

[mejim707]

Ok, I broke the nut off.

Turns out the adjustment "block", or as it's actually called the "pivot", has a few semi-stripped threads. That was causing the lock nut to spin in place.

Tomorrow I'm going to get a new lock nut, pivot and plastic bushing and get it back together. At least now I can adjust the steering the correct way, as much as I want.

I swear, the previous owner(s) must have pieced this poor thing together form spare parts they found around. It was a wreck when I got it. It's sad because this boat deserves better. But that's why I'm here bringing it back to life, the correct way!

 

[mejim707]

Well, absolutely nobody has this pivot part. Apparently This is such an obscure part that it does not get stocked anywhere and with BRP being down we can’t even order it!

If anyone has advice on where I can check that would stock this part please let me know.

The part number is 277000456

 

[mejim707]

I found the part at Leaders RPM in Michigan. Nobody has this part, anywhere! I'm happy they do though phew! I did not want to try and reuse the part I have because it would no doubt cause me a bunch of headache.

The new part should be here Tuesday of next week. Sucks to have to wait, but I'm more interested in doing this correctly than getting right back out on the water.

 

[POPPS]

Leave no stone unturned.

 

[mejim707]

I got the new pivot from Leaders and it's on and the alignment is adjusted perfectly. The boat tracks straight as an arrow now at speed and I don't even need to hold the wheel for it to keep tracking straight. Before this I needed to hold the wheel at 10 oclock position. No more! Woohoo

 

[POPPS]

Way to go,,,great result
.

 

[mejim707]

Update here. So, due to extreme traffic and gnarly waves on the lake, the most I've been able to do is about 35MPH until recently again. This lake is madness. It's like the ocean when boat traffic is high. And a small boat like this gets manhandled. Think of a pot of boiling water then take a tiny boat toy and toss it into that boiling pot. That's how this lake gets lol

Recently however as the traffic has dropped off so I can open it up again. While my updates before still apply, the boat tracks straight as an arrow up to 35MPH. This was a big improvement!

However, 35 - 45 I have to hold the wheel further and further to the left as the speed increases. So anything above 35 I have to hold the wheel to the left to maintain a straight path. It really wants to pull to the right and I can't figure out why. All the adjustments appear to be spot on and everything up to 35MPH it right on the money.

I can't figure out why speeds above 35 pull so hard to the right.

Any advise would be awesome or if you have a similar issue please share!

 

[POPPS]

Not sure how many motors you have,,,if “2”…then possibly one pump is “pushing” more than the other…if 2..I had one recently where the reverse gate was dragging

 

[mejim707]

Not sure how many motors you have,,,if “2”…then possibly one pump is “pushing” more than the other…if 2..I had one recently where the reverse gate was dragging

Hey POPPS! It's just a single 787. The pump is in excellent condition and the wear ring is essentially new. Up to 35 it tracks straight as an arrow, where I don't even need to hold the wheel. But 35 and up I have to hold the wheel to the left to maintain a straight path. If I let go it will pull to the right.

Maybe my steering is very close to perfect, but at that speed perhaps the dynamic of water flow is enough to cause it to pull?

 

[POPPS]

Truly..it should go straight all the way to top,,,hhmm…had this symptom with twin engines…is the intake grate there…does it have trim tabs?,,,is te steering tight?,,,or loose, because that will definitely do it.

 

[mejim707]

Truly..it should go straight all the way to top,,,hhmm…had this symptom with twin engines…is the intake grate there…does it have trim tabs?,,,is te steering tight?,,,or loose, because that will definitely do it.

The gate is there, it has 1 trim control but I don't know what the trim tabs would be. I'll check the parts diagram but I don't see anything missing at the pump. This is a single Rotax 787 in a 96 Challenger boat.

The steering is also tight and all bushings at the pump are new and the entire pump assembly moves and is as tight and smooth as the new models. I tweaked out on the pump to perfect it. Then I went to some Seadoo dealers and checked the new models to make sure my pump was as perfect as the brand new ones. It's on point!

But the steering above 35 pulls right. It used to pull right across the entire speed range until I fixed the adjustment in the helm. So now it's only doing this 35 and up. It's annoying and at higher speeds it impacts steering.

Maybe the adjustment is like 95% and this works great up to 35. But maybe this is just enough to pull above 35? Not sure.

 

[POPPS]

Nope,,,this is perplexing and can be a safety concern..gotta figure this out…

 

[mejim707]

Nope,,,this is perplexing and can be a safety concern..gotta figure this out…

So I looked and this boat doesn't have any trim tabs, I think you could get them after market, but I can't find anything for this boat in the parts lists. But, I think I may invest in some anyway because apparently they tweak the feel and stability a bit.

For now, I'm going to tweak the steering again to bring the nozzle a bit further to the left. Not much, just a touch. Maybe this will do it but I'll definitely report back!

 

[POPPS]

Is the pump square in the pump cavity?.are the bushings in the pump nozzle tight…can you post pics of the pump, nozzle,,,transome,,,has I always done this???…did you just buy it,,,Our shop does boats..and skis,,,wondering if you have a water soaked hull???…was it sunk??,,,we get boats that were partially submerged,,the foam is soaked with water and the boat floats with a “pitch”…just thinking outside the box

 

[POPPS]

Tweaking the steering may be an option… your steering wheel should be level and centred with the nozzle centered.

 

[mejim707]

Is the pump square in the pump cavity?.are the bushings in the pump nozzle tight…can you post pics of the pump, nozzle,,,transome,,,has I always done this???…did you just buy it,,,Our shop does boats..and skis,,,wondering if you have a water soaked hull???…was it sunk??,,,we get boats that were partially submerged,,the foam is soaked with water and the boat floats with a “pitch”…just thinking outside the box

All good points! Thank you!

SUNK / WATER LOGGED:
I don't think it was ever sunk and when it sits in water it's very buoyant with no signs of a droop on either side. The rear deck sits above water by about 4 inches or so as well. All the inside is bone dry. There is no way for me to see the stringers. I just know that it gets on plane within 2 - 3 seconds and if it was water logged I don't think it would be as crisp, fast and buoyant as it is.

BUSHINGS:
All bushings at the nozzle are tight and new. I replaced every one of them with the correct brand new OEM Seadoo parts.

PUMP SQUARE:
I'm not really sure about this. I've had the pump off a few times, and the mounting screws don't really have much play to get it out of square much if at all. When I install the pump I align it with the mounting screws, and the pump cooling water inlet, and it seems to go on exactly as it comes off and there's no sign that I can see of a misalignment. But I'll get some pictures over!

PURCHASE:
I got this used from someone who wasn't using it and just letting it go to waste in their yard. It was a disaster and lots wrong and lots they tried to hack together. Parts missing, wrong stuff, things half installed, carbs falling off and so on. I've spent a decent amount of time researching, and browsing forums, to learn all about it and get it right. It's right there! So close to perfect.

As it sits, this boat idles smooth, gets on plane in a few seconds, and absolutely rips with top speed of 45MPH so far. I'm a perfectionist though so everything needs to be dialed in and on point. But it's really close. I love it!

Thanks again for the feedback and questions. All good things to check!

 

[mejim707]

I called Nauticas and they recommended these trim tabs.
Low Profile Smart Tabs – Nauticus Incorporated - SXL957-60

POPPS, thanks for mentioning this! From what I see these make a huge improvement in ride quality and stability on choppy water. And the lake here gets crazy well of 5 foot waves around the massive basins!

There's a local dealer that has the SX9510-60 models. I prefer these and they say it should also work for my boat. I'm going to go pick them up in the morning.

 

[mejim707]

So I installed the Nauticus Smart Tabs SX and these are my take aways

• On plane in 1 second. At a stand still and punch it takes no time to get on plane regardless of the waves I was in.
• Wicked smooth. What an improvement in the ride. It really does feel like I got a suspension upgrade. The nose stays down and I cut through waves without much issue. However, some of these waves sneak up and I'm launching. I hate that but they come out of nowhere. This lake is like 90 feet deep so that's a contributing factor.
• Steering straightened out quite a bit. It's about 95% perfect now at any speed. I think a slight tweak to the steering adjustment tonight will make it perfect.
• I lost about 3 MPH off my top speed. Understandable since now I have a few panels dragging the water but It's totally fine with me for the ride quality. Plus I don't need to beat the crap out of the engine.

All in all, I'm happy with this upgrade. And they're real easy to remove as well so if I ever want a little more top end, I can always pull them!