starting problems 240 efi

[djwdoo]

I am having starting problems also (240 efi). I have checked everything up to the elec fuel pump including voltage and jumped negative to ground(pump works). I don't have a pressure gauge, but I have fuel all the way into the VS. What is this "trigger" and what might I check next. (float and needle valve were free moving)

thanks,

djwdoo

 

[djwdoo]

additional

I do have spark, checked fuel flow at every point up to the vapor separator plus what a mentioned previosly , it just cranks and cranks and cranks.

thanks again,

djwdoo

 

[rookie101]

Have you checked for spark? The trigger assembly is what controls the firing of the ignition coils. It is mounted underneath the flywheel on the 2001 and older 240s. Depending on the production date of your engine you may or may not have a trigger.

The quick way to tell if you have a trigger assembly is to see if you have an alternator. When they went away from the trigger and stator they replaced them with an alternator and crankshaft position sensor.

Aaron:cheers:

 

[rookie101]

You snuck in your update while I was typing my reply...:rofl:


When you pull the drain plug at the bottom of the vapor separator is it full of fuel? If not the needle valve may be jammed. If it is full of fuel you will need to go to your local auto parts store and rent a fuel injection fuel pressure tester to see if the high pressure pump in the separator is working.

Aaron:cheers:

 

[djwdoo]

addition 2x

oh...its a 2001, and I am not sure about an alternator. The only stator I am aware of is the one that holds the impellor shaft in place.
OOPs, I just found it on the parts diagram, But I don't see an alternator, just the stator and trigger.

 

[rookie101]

They changed the design about mid 2001, so like I said you may have either. The stator is the charging coil for the battery in place of an alternator. But if you have spark you don't need to worry about either of those. Just check out the fuel circuits like I mentioned.

Aaron:cheers:

 

[djwdoo]

VS is full of fuel, voltage at high pressure pump was 12.49 and I jumped the negative side of the high pressure pump to a ground and it operates. The float and needle valve moved freely.
So I guess the next step would be checking for the correct psi.

Thank You, I will let you know what I find.

 

[djwdoo]

back at it

hey there rookie101

well i broke down and got a fuel pressure tester. it gauges at 36psi with the pump running and 34psi when it cuts off.
i also checked the cylinder compression at 119-120psi on all 6. sure would like to know what the spec is for that as i haven't found it in the soft manual i have.
i also noticed there is not any oil flowing through the clear tubes from and to the oil pump. should there be if the engine isn't running yet?

any help would be great!

 

[djwdoo]

anybody.....need some guidance as to, where do I go next? Fuel system seems to check out. it just cranks and cranks and cranks.....help please.

 

[rookie101]

Sorry, I have had in-laws at the house since last week, and haven't even had time to turn the computer on.

What did the plugs look like when you had them out? were they soaked with fuel, or completely dry? i know you mentioned earlier that you had spark, but maybe check that again. If you're getting good spark and the plugs look dry, you could grab a test light and make sure your injectors are firing.

If the plugs are soaked, assuming they are OK themselves, you have a bad sensor, possibly a cylinder head temperature sensor or a TPS.

Let me know what you find.

Aaron:cheers:

 

[djwdoo]

howdy, welcome back

The plugs were a bit black and wet. I cleaned and regapped them to .040, they were .045 or better. No change.
What is this test light for the injectors you mentioned?
Where are these to sensors located?

 

[djwdoo]

more

Well, I bled the oil lines like the book says, I saw bubbles between the tank and the oil pump and they cleared up. I still didn't see oil in the line between the pump and the vapor separator? I also checked for spark again, this time leaving each plug out as I went. The dam thing popped with three plugs out!! hmmm, bad battery? Anything else that could be? I am still hesitant to actually start it without being sure oil is pumping into the vapor separator. How can i check that?

thanks again

 

[rookie101]

To see if there is oil getting to the vapor separator, just pull the drain plug at the bottom of it and have a look at the fuel that comes out. It should be slightly tinted the color of the oil and darker than just strait gas. Did you replace the plugs while you had them out? Any time you're unsure on the condition of the plugs on a two stroke, just replace them.

Now when you say it "popped" with three of the plugs out, are you saying it tried to start? It may just be a case of the plugs being weak and the engine is flooding. If not you may have a bad sensor like I previously mentioned that is causing it to flood.

To check to see if the injectors are being fired with a test light, just disconnect one of the plugs going to one and connect your test light between the two terminals of the plug. It should flash when you crank the engine.

Aaron:cheers:

 

[johnhibbs]

240 efi m2

I recently had to troubleshoot my 204 EFI M2 and the compression measured about 145 psi on all 6. I measured this after replacing the head gasket o-rings. It didn't solve my problem but I'm glad I did it because the o-rings were starting to degrade. My local mercury parts dealer said that they only last about 500 hours so I'm glad I didn't wait until the engine failed.

The two temp sensors are pretty easy to check with an ohm meter. The TPS sensor needs a volt meter to test. The manual says that you need a special test cable but you can punch a needle thru the blue wire for the Positive lead and ground for the negative lead. The manual says how to check it. Remember to reconnect the engine temp sensor when done.

Once you get the boat running make sure you check the conditon of the exhaust hoses if they are the originals. They degrade on the inside and restrict the exhaust flow. The hoses should be firm from one end to the other.

 

[johnhibbs]

fuel injector test with light?

I would like to understand that test. Are you testing the electrical spark by replacing the spark plug with a light bulb? What voltage light bulb are you using or is it a small neon bulb? Does that test the fuel injector some how?

When I was troubleshooting my 240EFI I was going to remove the intake manifold cover and look at the fuel injectors spraying but I decided it was too much trouble.

My guess it's one of the sensors or bad plugs. When you fix it I would replace the head gasket o-rings and exhaust hoses. Battery needs to be fully charged.

A lot a people with the 240EFI have a problem starting the engine once it's warmed up. I'm not sure why it's doing that but it happens everytime I go out for the day. I'm going to replace the starter to see if the problme goes away. An old starter may not crank the engine fast enough. When you removed 3 of the spark plugs it makes the engine easier to turn over. If you take all 6 out you can turn the flywheel by hand. Maybe by taking out just 3 of the plugs it made a lighter load on the stater and it almost got it started. Just a wild theory.

 

[johnhibbs]

good deal

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/e...13&_sacat=See-All-Categories&_fvi=1&viewitem=

 

[johnhibbs]

Garden hose water

I don't know if you just bought this boat and might not know a lot about it yet but make sure you only run the engine with the garden hose hooked up. Turn on the water after the engine is running and turn off the water then turn off the engine.

 

[rookie101]

I would like to understand that test. Are you testing the electrical spark by replacing the spark plug with a light bulb? What voltage light bulb are you using or is it a small neon bulb? Does that test the fuel injector some how?

All this checks is that the ECM is pulsing the injectors. You need to have an injector unplugged, and you use your test light across the terminals on the ECM side of the plug. If the test light flashes the ECM is telling the injector to fire. It does not check the injector at all. For that I have an actual injector tester. It plugs into the injector, and in conjunction with a fuel pressure gauge, you note the drop in fuel pressure for each injector as you fire them. If one is lower than the others it needs to be replaced.

Aaron:cheers:

 

[matthewroell]

2001 Challenger 240 EFI Exhuast delaminating

Anyone know how "soft" the exhuast lines are supposed to be on these 240 EFI engines. I saw a post about them delaminating and checked mine but don't know how plyable they are supposed to be. I am having problems with my engine not running at 3000-4500 RPM range and think the exhuast flow may be causing issues. Help?

Also the sucker idles really really high when I start it out of the water. How bad is it if you run the hose before you start it up?

 

[johnhibbs]

exhaust hoses

The new exhaust hoses I put in are extremely stiff. They are not OEM. I bought exhaust hose from a local shop here in San Diego. They are more like pipes than hoses. I can't squeeze the new hoses.

You can take your hoses off and look inside. If they are the originals I'm sure they are getting soft. Another easier check is to open up the rear hatch so you can see the hoses when you are on the water. Have someone rev the engine above 4 k if you can and you will see the hoses expand like a balloon. The water gets dammed up and stops the exhaust flow. Did you know water flows through the pipes? The pressure builds up and expands the soft area.

 

[matthewroell]

delaminating

Yeah I checked the exhuast hoses yesterday and I can easily sqeeze the hose with just my thumb and a couple fingers. I am gunna take the hoses off today and check the inside. What type of replacements did you get? I was thinkin about getting really rigid ones but can't figure out where to get my hands on some. Is it somethin you could get from an auto or boat mechanic shop? No I did not know that water flows through the exhuast, I thought it only went through the cooling system. learn somethin new every day.

 

[WAJetboating]

I don't know if you just bought this boat and might not know a lot about it yet but make sure you only run the engine with the garden hose hooked up. Turn on the water after the engine is running and turn off the water then turn off the engine.

I know this is an old comment, but correcting it is important.

You are describing the sequence for a ROTAX engine. The Mercury engine is the exact opposite. Water on FIRST, then engine on, then engine off, then water off LAST. Unlike Rotax engines, the Mercury is entirely self-draining and it is perfectly fine to run the water while the engine is not operating.

Never run the Mercury engine without water running. Not even for 30 seconds. The manuals are adamant about this, as are the factory technicians when you talk to them. ALWAYS turn on the water first, and make sure it is flowing properly (out the "pee hole" as well as coming out of the steering nozzle exhaust and probably the jetdrive intake grate) before starting the engine.

 

[WAJetboating]

How bad is it if you run the hose before you start it up?

As noted in my other response, it's not "bad" at all - it's the recommended procedure. Sequence is:

Water on FIRST
Engine on
Engine off
Water off LAST

You can run water through the Mercury engine indefinitely whether the engine is running or not. No restrictions as with the Rotax engines.

On the other hand, you can run the Rotax engines very briefly with no water. You must NEVER do that with the Mercury engine. You MUST have water flowing at all times when the Mercury engine is running.

 

[matthewroell]

240 efi

Thanks for the clarification. I have been using it in salt water since I bought it and I would allways run hose before turning it on when I clean the salt water out. Thought maybe I was screwing it up when I saw the posts. What rpm does yours run when you are running it on the hose, because mine used to idle 1000 in the water but would go nutzzz when I tried to run it on the hose.

 

[WAJetboating]

Thanks for the clarification. I have been using it in salt water since I bought it and I would allways run hose before turning it on when I clean the salt water out. Thought maybe I was screwing it up when I saw the posts.

Nope, you're doing it properly. The engine manual says to run the hose at least ten minutes when flushing for salt water, and you don't have to be running the engine during that time. However, if it were salt water, I'd personally run the engine for at least a couple of minutes because doing so forces water into cooling passages that passive flushing does not.

What rpm does yours run when you are running it on the hose, because mine used to idle 1000 in the water but would go nutzzz when I tried to run it on the hose.

Idle should be ~1100 all the time, in or out of water. Unlike 2-stroke Rotax engines whose idle varies in and out of water, the SportJet isn't supposed to do that. Mine is ~1100 on the tach in the water or on the trailer.

If yours is overrevving on the hose, you have cause for concern. The various manuals and voice conversations with Mercury techs vary somewhat, but the absolute maximum RPM's while on the hose should not exceed 2000. This is because driving water in via the hose flushing connector is not the same as having water pumped in from the high pressure region of the jetdrive. Not all water cooled areas of the engine receive water when on the hose. Running above 1100-2000 RPM (depending on what source you trust) risks engine damage.