Rotax Challenger 180 vs Speedster 200

[LilMikey]

In my area there are a few 2004-2006 Speedsters and Challengers that are in my price range.

One is a '06 Challenger but it only has the little 185hp single supercharged Rotax. The others are '04-'05 Speedster 200s.

I'm a bit torn. Most of the time we'll be 4-6 people cruising, beaching, drinking, repeat on the intracoastal and St. John's rivers. We'll be pulling tubes and wake boards once in a while. I'd like to tow it to the keys for snorkeling and zipping around. On the rarest occasions I might toss in a fishing rod. We don't really need tons and tons of power however I've been less than impressed by the boats we've been renting with 90-135hp outdrives.

So... at first blush the Challenger layout seems superior to the Speedster however since one is 18' and the other is 20' I'm questioning whether there is enough difference to be concerned about.

I do not like the supercharger maintenance on the 180 but do like the efficiency. How much better is the fuel economy on the 185 supercharged vs the dual naturally aspirated 155s on the 200? Is the 185 underpowered for the Challenger?

That '06 Challenger is also a year or two newer than the Speedsters and it looks like I'll have an easier time fitting it in our garage however we have two car-widths to spare so I think either will make it.

Any and all advice is appreciated.

 

[davo]

I regularly have 5 on board and pull tubes, skiers and boarders. No probs with 255hp but I think 185 may struggle. Remember when you use the last 20 percent or so of power in the supercharged models the gas consumption really kicks in.
No supered rotexes are extremely simple and reliable. Less maintenance, better low down acceleration and better turning when very heavy.
My c180 is great, but if the s200 is the same price and you go out in smooth water, well I know what I'd go with. Be aware though the s200 is no good on cold days or with those who want to be sheltered.
Cheers

 

[LilMikey]

Thanks davo!

Not too worried about temp. It's pretty nice most of the year here in FL and the wife won't want to go out if it's cold either way.

Are either the C180 or Speedster 200 better in chop? I was under the impression that they were similar length, width, deadrise => similar handling in chop? The intracoastal can swell a little at the inlets but I don't foresee anything to severe. We've been taking a 19' deckboat with like a 16 degree deadrise through it and everyone has managed so far.

Thanks again.

 

[davo]

As you know, the choppier the water the slower you go. With this in mind both would be fine but the s200 I'd imagine will give a wetter ride. My 180 (2010) with windscreen is about as comfortable in choppy water as my friends 6.5m runabout. That said it was slow, and you become accustomed to going faster in these boats. The s200 has a tendency to porpoise a bit at really high speeds if water isn't glassy. There are owners of them here who could elaborate further. I think generally most would think the c180 may be a bit better in rough water than the longer s200 but no by much. More bow space in the c180, the s200 looks cooler though!

 

[timeman]

I tried both models before buying the challenger, my two cents: I would agree that if you plan to have 5+ on board and pull a wake boarder the 180 will indeed struggle, (transferring weight to the bow really makes a difference) ....having said that, if your main use / priority is as you said, "4-6 people cruising, beaching, drinking, repeat on rivers, pulling tubes and wake boards once in a while"...(which were pretty much my priorities), I think the layout ergonomics and creature comforts of the challenger will prove far superior to the speedster. No doubt the speedster looks lower and faster, but 6 people comfortably spending the day in a confined space may prove more valuable than looking cool at the launch ? BTW, I don't think fuel economy plays into any final decision on which boat to buy....

 

[speedster32940]

The speedster 200 gets my vote... I considered both models, and test drove a new 180 with 215hp, leaving me very under-whelmed. The twin 155hp speedster is much more responsive, and has no Supercharger worries. I don't understand the comments above about the 180 being more comfortable for a group of 4-6. The layout is basically the same for both boats: Large bench, two swivel chairs and an open bow. I was also not comfortable with the low bow angle of the 180, whereas the speedster has quite a bit more ability to take a wave on the bow without soaking the passengers. I think that the greater weight of the speedster helps with rough water handling too. Having two engines is a comfort if you suck something up in one of them (as has happened to us) at least you can limp home. Also, the Speedster has a nice sun pad, which we use a lot, whereas the 180 just has lockers behind the bench. The lack of a windshield may be an issue for some, but it does not bother me. We rarely use it when it is cold enough to need the windshield, plus windshields are a pain to keep clean and spot free, especially in salt water. The cooler as part of the driver's dash is really nice to have. We store our Speedster in a standard two car garage. The swing away tongue makes it easy to do, with the boat at a slight angle in the garage. Just my thoughts...

 

[davo]

What MPG/KPL & top speed do you get out of the 310hp model?
Nice boat.

 

[speedster32940]

I never pay attention to the MPG (it has to be better than the 30 foot Larson with a 100 gallon tank I used to have, so that's about all that matters to me) . I just top it off whenever the tank gets down about half, which takes quite a while if you aren't driving like a lunatic.

The boat will top out at about 54-55 mph with just me in it (confirmed on a GPS). Not as fast as the supercharged models, but fast enough for me & no headaches. Thanks, it is a nice boat, fits our needs very well.

What MPG/KPL & top speed do you get out of the 310hp model?
Nice boat.

 

[LilMikey]

Thanks for all of the feedback so far, guys!

Could someone please elaborate on the 'creature comforts' that the Challenger provides vs the Speedster? The big one to me appears to be the open, wrap around bow seating vs the speedsters two seats - which is where I think they get the 8th seat in the Challengers 8 person capacity. Other than that, I see the Challenger has the walk-through rear seat which is nice I suppose but not really notable and the windshield which again, would be nice but probably not notable down in the FL sun.

Are there other properties of that boat that make it more comfortable than the Speedster?

 

[speedster32940]

The legroom between the bow seats on the speedster is tight for adults. However, the large storage compartment in the bow is wonderful to use for life jackets, etc.

Thanks for all of the feedback so far, guys!

Could someone please elaborate on the 'creature comforts' that the Challenger provides vs the Speedster? The big one to me appears to be the open, wrap around bow seating vs the speedsters two seats - which is where I think they get the 8th seat in the Challengers 8 person capacity. Other than that, I see the Challenger has the walk-through rear seat which is nice I suppose but not really notable and the windshield which again, would be nice but probably not notable down in the FL sun.
Are there other properties of that boat that make it more comfortable than the Speedster?

 

[BMANN06]

If you want the cadillac go with the challenger.
If you want the corvette go with the speedster.

Realistically though, when your dropping that kinda dough. Test drive each, and bring the wifey and fam. With about an hour or two of seat time in each rig you and the fam will figure out which one works best. They're both good choices, don't think you'll regret either.

 

[LilMikey]

Realistically though, when your dropping that kinda dough. Test drive each, and bring the wifey and fam. With about an hour or two of seat time in each rig you and the fam will figure out which one works best. They're both good choices, don't think you'll regret either.

I would love to be able to do that however the closest boat we are considering is about 3 hours away and they go up from there. Also, no fam... just me and wifey. The 4-6 will be visitors and drunken idiot friends.

 

[speedster32940]

I would love to be able to do that however the closest boat we are considering is about 3 hours away and they go up from there. Also, no fam... just me and wifey. The 4-6 will be visitors and drunken idiot friends.

I promise you that the drunken idiot friends will like the speedster better! Drunken idiots always like to go as fast as possible and don't care about windscreens! :cheers:

 

[speedster32940]

By the way, for New Years Day we enjoyed about 4 hours out on the Indian River today zipping around, soaking in the sun & listening to live music floating across the water from our local waterfront restaurant. God, I am so happy we got out of NY State!

 

[BMANN06]

I promise you that the drunken idiot friends will like the speedster better! Drunken idiots always like to go as fast as possible and don't care about windscreens! :cheers:

Coming from a drunken idiot .. I agree 100%

 

[LilMikey]

Sorry to bring this one back... but the annual bonus just came through so I'm just about ready to pull the trigger. There's a gorgeous challenger SE with the tower in town and I think the wife really likes the look of it vs the speedsters.

After reading through the forums the thing that's scaring me the most about the challenger is getting stranded if/when you suck something up. Reading through this forum it sounds like it's either feast or famine. I'm seeing people who have taken their boats out 3 times, 3 hours total and sucked up something each time and others that have never had to give it more than a throttle jostle to shake it loose. It sounds like most are able to still move, albeit slowly, with a clogged impeller? For people piloting the intracoastal, what's the real skinny? Am I making a mountain out of a mole-hill or should I buy a sea-tow membership if I get the Challenger?

Again, thanks for all of the great advice!

 

[LilMikey]

Oh, and one more quicky... does anyone have an approximate length of the speedster 200 on the stock trailer? I'd like to shove it in the 2 car potion of our garage.

Thanks again.

 

[drop]

Oh, and one more quicky... does anyone have an approximate length of the speedster 200 on the stock trailer? I'd like to shove it in the 2 car potion of our garage.

Thanks again.

total length of my 2012 200 on the standard karavan trailer is 20'6" with the tongue folded, 22'7" unfolded.

 

[sgoyal]

I bought 2011 C180SE last year and took the boat out minimum 10 times and never had any issue. Also, I'm a rookie with boat.

 

[timeman]

The speedster and challenger are both jet drive....Odds of intake suckage should be same / same. If you boat where there is always a lot of flotsam and jetsam around you may want to consider a prop drive....

 

[LilMikey]

Thanks for the feedback again guys.

timeman - true but you have a backup jet to limp home on with the speedster. Or am I misunderstanding how that setup works?

 

[timeman]

By backup pump, I'm assuming you mean back up engine, so yeah, a twin engine boat will always have a second engine / drive to get you home, but that would be true of the twin engine challengers, so there is no particular advantage to either model, just the setup. My 180 is a single 4-tec, I have had a few clogs, all but one was pretty easy to clear in the water. One time I had a hard knot piece of stick that grooved itself onto the impeller shaft fins, the boat was still drive-able to get back, but it was a slow ride. Once on land I was able to get my arm and a small screw driver in far enough to dislodge it. I would think the reasons for buying a twin engine ride would be performance, not back up for a blockage? I have always believed that when it comes to boats BIGGER is better, so, no matter the reason, having two is better than having one B)

 

[LilMikey]

Hey again, pulled the trigger on a 2006 Challenger 180 with a tower. Only has about 55 hours on it, all but 5 or so were up in fresh-water NC lakes, and was just in for 50 hour service. It still has the older washers so that's at the top of the to-do list but the boat hauled butt in a sea trial, all electrics and mechanics seemed to work well, and apart from a small 1" split in one of the rear seats the upholstery is great.

 

[sgoyal]

Hey again, pulled the trigger on a 2006 Challenger 180 with a tower. Only has about 55 hours on it, all but 5 or so were up in fresh-water NC lakes, and was just in for 50 hour service. It still has the older washers so that's at the top of the to-do list but the boat hauled butt in a sea trial, all electrics and mechanics seemed to work well, and apart from a small 1" split in one of the rear seats the upholstery is great.

Congrats man.. Change the Ceramic Washers and Enjoy the ride...

 

[timeman]

If my memory serves....it's time (weather permitting) for you to start: "cruising, beaching, drinking, repeat" Seriously, congrats on the purchase, Happy Boating!