Oil leak and Manifold gasket,

[alexd51]

So i been working on my challenger 1800 and every time i fix one thing either i break or it breaks because is old. Well i cleaned the fuel tank as well as the oil tank, changed fuel filters and oil filter and also most of the oil lines . After working on this boat for almost 3 weeks i was ready to test but before i bleed the oil lines and when i got done it was too late to start the engine just because of my neighbors so i left it for the next day.

Well today is the next day, i got up early and while drinking my morning coffee i walked over to the boat and i find that all the oil i left in the tank the night before is now covering the floor of my carport. I dont get a break, well after double checking all the hoses none of them are leaking i look all over and finally find the oil is coming from under the port side motor specifically under the exhaust.
Well i think i was going to be able to take part of the exhaust out and fix the leak but after removing the 2 bolts holding the pipe i still cant get it out, well thats fine i think if i take the part that is connected to the manifold i will be able to take it all out and fix the leak or im wrong???

Now my question about the gasket is, is this a regular sort of compressed cardboard gasket or something else? only asking because i have diferent gasket making material from other projects and i rather do one that spending $13.95 for a gasket.

 

[LouDoo]

I'm not sure I understand exactly where the oil is leaking. Are you saying from the motor? Can you post a picture or located on this drawing.

http://partsfinder.onlinemicrofiche...adoojb&a=180&b=17&c=0&d=-OIL-INJECTION-SYSTEM

Moving this to the 2-stroke boat forum.

Lou

 

[alexd51]

[MENTION=31048]LouDoo[/MENTION]
Sorry for posting on the wrong place had various tabs open on different threads though i was in the right one.
The leak is underneath the purple tube on the side of the motor impossible to reach unless the tube is removed.

 

[racerxxx]

You can remove those two screws, the coupler to the water box, then the band clamp. Then it should be able to come off. It's also rtv'd at that big joint. Make sure that's clean before you re-rtv the joint.

Just make sure you don't clamp it so right that the noise clamp dices the tubing.

The gasket you asked about is reinforced, you can't make your own that would last.

Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk

 

[alexd51]

You can remove those two screws, the coupler to the water box, then the band clamp. Then it should be able to come off. It's also rtv'd at that big joint. Make sure that's clean before you re-rtv the joint.

Just make sure you don't clamp it so right that the noise clamp dices the tubing.

The gasket you asked about is reinforced, you can't make your own that would last.

Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk

Ok i guess i'll buy the gasket monday. Except for the 2 hoses is there anything else i should be careful with when i take it appart?

 

[racerxxx]

You should be able to leave the upper on and just pull the lower pipe. Just check the fitting. If you have a phone with a camera you can aim it between the pipe and the engine and snag a pic. Just make sure you're 100% positive that is where your leak is, it's a good bit of work in a boat, especially the port engine.

Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk

 

[alexd51]

You should be able to leave the upper on and just pull the lower pipe. Just check the fitting. If you have a phone with a camera you can aim it between the pipe and the engine and snag a pic. Just make sure you're 100% positive that is where your leak is, it's a good bit of work in a boat, especially the port engine.

Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk

I removed the 2 bolts on the lower and i been trying to get it out but theres not enough space to get it out. The water box is all the way back but its not enough to pull the lower pipe out.
Pushing it forward it goes a bit under the upper pipe but again not enough to be able to pull it out of the fitting.The only way i see it can be taken out will be if the upper wasn't there.

 

[racerxxx]

Bummer.

Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk

 

[alexd51]

Bummer.

Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk

I would have to take the upper out anyhow now that i already undid the lower part, there is plenty of old rtv in there and to be honest i cant even see or find the bronze ring thats supposed to be in there. Looking at it without removing it does not look like there is any gasket on the manifold. I'll know tomorrow when i get it out.
BTW
Any torque for the bolts on the manifold??

 

[alexd51]

So i found the leak and i have no clue how to proceed after this so i would love to hear any suggestions and comments.
I took the upper and lower pipe and finally found the oil leak and it was coming from some weird place that i thought didn't have anything to do with the oil, but then again i'm a newb so i might be wrong.

Sorry about the pics they are not mine tried taking my own but they were too blurry so i stole some from another forum.
Here is were the leak is.Is right at the top of the arrow.

[MENTION=57920]racerxxx[/MENTION] [MENTION=31048]LouDoo[/MENTION]

 

[racerxxx]

You need to determine if the plug is rusted out our just leaking around the edge. If it's not rusted out, clean the hell out of it and smear it with jb weld. It's also obvious that you need to drain the rv cavity first since its lower than the outlet. If it's rusted out you'll have to buy a new plug, I've never had to do that but you'd still need sealant in that when that job is done.

Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk

 

[alexd51]

You need to determine if the plug is rusted out our just leaking around the edge. If it's not rusted out, clean the hell out of it and smear it with jb weld. It's also obvious that you need to drain the rv cavity first since its lower than the outlet. If it's rusted out you'll have to buy a new plug, I've never had to do that but you'd still need sealant in that when that job is done.

Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk

Its not rusted just leaking on one side of the plug.

 

[racerxxx]

Drain the oil--probably going to have to suck it out with something. Then spray the entire plug area down with starting fluid, then blow it off with an air nozzle from an air compressor. Repeat this several times. Scuff the area with some sand paper and clean it again. Then mix up some JB weld and put it on there with a popsicle stick or something and just hope the oil doesn't seep while it's trying to cure. The ideal way to do it would be to remove the engine and flip it so the oil drains away from the plug. Either way, it not a fun repair nor is it a guaranteed repair.

 

[alexd51]

Drain the oil--probably going to have to suck it out with something. Then spray the entire plug area down with starting fluid, then blow it off with an air nozzle from an air compressor. Repeat this several times. Scuff the area with some sand paper and clean it again. Then mix up some JB weld and put it on there with a popsicle stick or something and just hope the oil doesn't seep while it's trying to cure. The ideal way to do it would be to remove the engine and flip it so the oil drains away from the plug. Either way, it not a fun repair nor is it a guaranteed repair.

Well it will have to do for now, been working on this boat since i got it. It was running then but needed some stuff done, fix one thing find another to fix and i have not been able to take it out not even one time. No fun....
Like i said before i'm a newb with this boat , can you tell me if the steering wheel is supposed to move around freely or does it lock ??

Can i run the boat on just 1 motor???

 

[racerxxx]

You should be able to move the steering lock to lock. Can't take it out on one engine, it won't have enough balls and with out doing some other stuff you will fill the non running engine with water. You will need to disconnect the steering cable from the nozzle and confirm that you can move the wheel smoothly, then proceed to checking the nozzles pivot smoothly, they should require very little effort to turn both with one hand. We can cross that bridge when you determine which is the culprit.

I understand your frustration but keep in mind your boat is 17 years old. I'll go as far as saying that is 16 years of neglect and improper maintenance or lack of. I will say my hat is off to you guys who buy these boats and get them back running, I would fully gut the boat and rebuild/replace every last item that needed attention. Put the time and money in so you can have a fun and enjoyable boating trip every time. I'd hate the feeling of "What's next?" every time I'm on the water.

Just keep up beat, these really are great boats once all the issues are ironed out.

 

[alexd51]

You should be able to move the steering lock to lock. Can't take it out on one engine, it won't have enough balls and with out doing some other stuff you will fill the non running engine with water. You will need to disconnect the steering cable from the nozzle and confirm that you can move the wheel smoothly, then proceed to checking the nozzles pivot smoothly, they should require very little effort to turn both with one hand. We can cross that bridge when you determine which is the culprit.

I understand your frustration but keep in mind your boat is 17 years old. I'll go as far as saying that is 16 years of neglect and improper maintenance or lack of. I will say my hat is off to you guys who buy these boats and get them back running, I would fully gut the boat and rebuild/replace every last item that needed attention. Put the time and money in so you can have a fun and enjoyable boating trip every time. I'd hate the feeling of "What's next?" every time I'm on the water.

Just keep up beat, these really are great boats once all the issues are ironed out.

Well took steering cable off the nozzles and the nozzles move left and right but needs a bit of lubricant. In the other hand steering wheel does not move around only about an inch to either side just freeplay no actually cable movement at all :banghead:

 

[racerxxx]

OK, disconnect the cable from the steering helm to verify your don't have a bad helm and that it is in fact the cable.

Nozzles, lube probably is only a band aid fix. where the nozzles pivot there is plastic bushings that press into the nozzles. The aluminum nozzles corrode and squeeze on the plastic bushings which in turn squeeze the metal sleeve that the nozzles pivot on. You need to press the sleeve from the bushing and then press the bushings out and clean up the bores of the nozzles. A wood dowel with some sand paper will do the trick. I would make them able to press back in with your fingers. Also clean up the metal sleeves too so they slip into the plastic bushings. I like the nozzles to move with two fingers without the cable attached

You're working with part# 5 and 31

 

[alexd51]

Thanks i will verify that probably tomorrow and let you know.

 

[AndyC]

I am in kind of the same situation with a 1995 Speedster that I am trying to bring back to life, so I thought I would chime in with a few things I learned the hard way, hoping to save you some trouble.

Regarding the oil leak, I haven't run into that (yet) but while you have the exhaust out, check the welch plugs on the lower side of the tuned pipe. If they seem weak or are showing any signs of corrosion, I would replace them proactively. I had my exhaust out to fix a broken stud on the manifold, only to put everything back together to have one of my plugs blow out on the test run.

Also, regarding the exhaust manifold gasket, the first time I replaced it I bought an aftermarket gasket that was reinforced felt. It was a little cheaper than the BRP part, and didn't leak, but the second time, I used the BRP part, and in my opinion, BRP was much higher quality. It wasn't felt, and had a more rubberized mating surface. It was also thinner than the aftermarket which might impact the alignment of the tuned pipe to cone connection. Not sure if it matters, but just my 2 cents.

Regarding the steering issue, disconnect the cable and check it like racer said, but also check the gears in the helm while you are in there. I replaced both steering cables in the boat because according to the guy I bought it from, the left one was all that was wrong with it. HAHAHAHA! Yeah right! But anyway, the left cable was seized, but I guess the PO tried to force it with the wheel and in the process broke several teeth off of the half moon shaped horizontal gear in the helm. It caused the steering wheel to skip over to the far side of that gear and only gave about an inch or two of travel between the stop on one side and the seized cable on the other. So I replaced both cables, only to find that I still needed to replace the helm. There are four bolts on the top, and you should be able to pull the top plate off and visually inspect it without taking it out of the console. Mine had chunks missing so it should be a pretty obvious pass / fail. I'm assuming that it is similar or the same for your boat.

Full disclosure: I have only had this boat since July, and have no previous experience with Sea Doo's, so this is a newb response, but hopefully it helps you avoid some of the things that tripped me up.

 

[alexd51]

I am in kind of the same situation with a 1995 Speedster that I am trying to bring back to life, so I thought I would chime in with a few things I learned the hard way, hoping to save you some trouble.

Regarding the oil leak, I haven't run into that (yet) but while you have the exhaust out, check the welch plugs on the lower side of the tuned pipe. If they seem weak or are showing any signs of corrosion, I would replace them proactively. I had my exhaust out to fix a broken stud on the manifold, only to put everything back together to have one of my plugs blow out on the test run.

Also, regarding the exhaust manifold gasket, the first time I replaced it I bought an aftermarket gasket that was reinforced felt. It was a little cheaper than the BRP part, and didn't leak, but the second time, I used the BRP part, and in my opinion, BRP was much higher quality. It wasn't felt, and had a more rubberized mating surface. It was also thinner than the aftermarket which might impact the alignment of the tuned pipe to cone connection. Not sure if it matters, but just my 2 cents.

Regarding the steering issue, disconnect the cable and check it like racer said, but also check the gears in the helm while you are in there. I replaced both steering cables in the boat because according to the guy I bought it from, the left one was all that was wrong with it. HAHAHAHA! Yeah right! But anyway, the left cable was seized, but I guess the PO tried to force it with the wheel and in the process broke several teeth off of the half moon shaped horizontal gear in the helm. It caused the steering wheel to skip over to the far side of that gear and only gave about an inch or two of travel between the stop on one side and the seized cable on the other. So I replaced both cables, only to find that I still needed to replace the helm. There are four bolts on the top, and you should be able to pull the top plate off and visually inspect it without taking it out of the console. Mine had chunks missing so it should be a pretty obvious pass / fail. I'm assuming that it is similar or the same for your boat.

Full disclosure: I have only had this boat since July, and have no previous experience with Sea Doo's, so this is a newb response, but hopefully it helps you avoid some of the things that tripped me up.

Hello AndyC and welcome.
The welch plugs have been replaced not too long ago from the looks of the welds, only thing they actually did right they replaced all of them im guessing at the same time.
I will be buying the BRP gasket ,as a side note there was no gasket used the last time it was taken out and in its place there was about a tube of red RTV. It was a PITA to remove, and just thinking about it i did not clean the manifold side DAMMIT.

According to the guy i exchanged my bike for his boat said ,"You will be in the water in a week after you put in new fuel filters and new gas" its been 2 weeks and 2 fuel filters,2 oil filters,oil lines,fuel sender unit float,oil tank fix,3 cables replaced from the helm to the motor and now the steering issue. Im pretty sure will find more putting stuff back and other either breaking or finding they did a bandaid fix years ago.

Like you im a total newb not just to sea doo but to boats and if it wasn't for this forum the boat would have been on craigslist the same week i got it.

 

[alexd51]

OK, disconnect the cable from the steering helm to verify your don't have a bad helm and that it is in fact the cable.

Nozzles, lube probably is only a band aid fix. where the nozzles pivot there is plastic bushings that press into the nozzles. The aluminum nozzles corrode and squeeze on the plastic bushings which in turn squeeze the metal sleeve that the nozzles pivot on. You need to press the sleeve from the bushing and then press the bushings out and clean up the bores of the nozzles. A wood dowel with some sand paper will do the trick. I would make them able to press back in with your fingers. Also clean up the metal sleeves too so they slip into the plastic bushings. I like the nozzles to move with two fingers without the cable attached

You're working with part# 5 and 31

Hey [MENTION=57920]racerxxx[/MENTION]
Got the cable disconnected from the helm and steering box is fine. Got both nozzles out and like you said corrosion, took everything apart and after sanding got it all to fit nicely. Well took it further and sanded the whole nozzle primed and painted them.
Some time this week ill put it back together but I'm guessing i need a new steering cable.
Nothing to do with the old steering cable right?

 

[racerxxx]

You might luck out and lube the cable. Slide a tight fitting hose over the end by the helm and load it up with wd-40 and work the cable. See if it loosens up, or just buy a new one. If you buy a new one make sure you have all the rubber boots on it, and tie a string to it so when you pull it out you can tie the string to the new one and pull it back through.

Good deal on sanding the nozzles!

Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk

 

[racerxxx]

I should have posted this last night. One of our other users posted this pic. I'll assume it could be done the same for your steering cable, just remove the rubber boots on the cable.


http://www.seadooforum.com/showthre...sembly-Diagram&p=398454&viewfull=1#post398454