Need help complaining to Sea Doo NO service on a defective Challenger 185

[Redbarronracing]

My wonderful (defective) Challenger 185 is days from celebrating its 2nd anniversary from purchase. It was a left over 2007, so I got the boat and had to wait months to use it. I immediately noticed that it seemed down on power, and I thought that was the quietest supercharger I had ever heard (as in 0 sound). When I took it in for its 10 hour service, I asked them to check the supercharger as I was only able to do about 7300 rpm and 35 mph. They said everything was fine. Later in the summer, I had a little incident when I started the boat before realizing I was touching bottom. I took the boat to a different dealer as my regular dealer was booked for over 6 weeks. Along with the $700+ repair to the wear ring and impellor, I asked to have the supercharger checked as it still was a 7300 rpm/35 mph boat after about 40 hours. Of course, nothing wrong. Before the warranty expired, I had the boat winterized and asked that the supercharger be checked as I knew the boat should be more powerful, nothing wrong. Warranty now expired, I took friends out for the first ride of 2009 season. About 30 minutes later, after a slow no wake ride, we started back but the boat had no power and vibrated so badly that I had to return at about 1500 rpm. Took the boat to a dealer who said, no problems.. "must have been a plastic bag or something in the impellor", but no damage. They “physically tested” the supercharger where they locked it down and checked to see where the clutch engaged, it was right, so no problems with the supercharger (and they water tested, thought it was fine). Funny thing, next 2 times out, boat would do 45+mph at about 7900-8000 and had a new whine sound. It then went back to a 7300rpm/35mph boat. I gave up and accepted that I had a non-supercharged boat. One day, I show up at the covered dock to take the boat out, but it will not go on plane. I stop and look to find the ski locker full of water and the bilge will not work. I check the fuse and it is fine. I took the boat back to the original dealer who says there are 2 or 3 other inline fuses that were blown. While there, he checks the supercharger and finds there is excessive play. Out of warranty, I contact Sea-Doo Customer service. They are going to contact the dealer. After a bunch of back and forth, they tell the dealer that I “had the opportunity to buy the extended warranty”. I decided that if I was going to pay that much for the boat, I wanted it to work, so I paid for a supercharger rebuild (the dealer was going to try to call a friend at Sea Doo to get some help on the cost, obviously that did not happen).
Everyone at work and anywhere it comes up knows the service Sea Doo has provided. The more I have thought about it (and especially with the comment Sea Doo told my dealer thinking they would not repeat), I want to find a place higher at Sea Doo to complain.
Does anyone know how to escalate a complaint at Sea Doo?

 

[dlowings]

wow, im sorry you had a spot of bad luck with this boat... Of the service centers you took these to, were they BRP certified ? The only number I know of is the one out of Canada, I myself tried to call it and was on hold so long I just gave up.... However with that said I do love my SeaDoo PWC...

 

[robin savell lloyd]

dealers?

Sorry to hear of this. When I was 19 years old I had worked as a mechanic at a couple authorised shops before, not knowing any thing about some of the products that we sold. It was guess work at time and I could call a 1-800 number if I could not figure it out. I have been into seadoo dealers after only spending about 6 months online researching tech info only to find out that some dealer sevice managers knew less than I did about what I was working on. What I am trying to say is that we may need to research the shops reputation before we pay them $100.00 per hour. There may be mechanics from this site that are close to you that have a good reputation. Good luck on this and I hope that someone will be able to help you out. There needs to be a sticky on this subject if there is not one already.

 

[dlowings]

I agree, I noticed a dealer section was posted but it is not in use... I would love to hear about other dealers in my area...

 

[seadoosnipe]

Is this common?

Is this common, to have bad service...? YES!... That's why so many of the members here, who know me, understand why I have a hard time with these guys. Like Robin pointed out, most of us here, who may do minor service on our machines, know more than those guys at the dealerships.

They are suppose to be BRP certified. But, do you know what it takes? There are so many of these places that hire a family friend, etc... Just to help them with their certifications. This way, they don't have to pay the new young employee the full mechanics pay..... Now mind you, these are my ramblings and opionions of what I've seen first hand.

This is not isolated to only a Seadoo. You'll find this kind of sloppy, incompetent, un-caring, greedy money grabbing service dealerships with cars, trucks, all boats (not just Seadoo), motorcycles...... any thing with a motor on it.

But, your problem has some differences. First, if you have told anyone affiliated with Seadoo about the problem with the flooding, you are at fault. Why? Because BRP states that Seadoo's are not to be left in the water. You are suppose to pull them out after each use for routine maintenance. Once the boat has finished it's run for the day, you are suppose to (required under warranty) to take the minimum precautions to flush, clean and lubricate the motor. If docked, you can't flush it. That's the only real concern I see from your side.

From that point, I would recommend talking to an attorney. It seems you have a case with your supercharger. Why? Because you complained that you did not hear it, your quoted speed was obvious to a supercharger problem (rpms should be at just over 8k) and the certified technician should have seen it on the B.U.D.S. software when it was serviced. Your boost pressure is visible to the software program and should have been a red flag to these guys. But, how are you going to proove it? Remember, you are the one bringing the allegations, so you will be the one who has to proove in a court, that the boat was never right to begin with.

I don't think contacting Seadoo will do a lot of good, from you anyway. Now, if you retain a lawyer and they contact Seadoo, you might get something done without taking it to court.

I'm not a lawyer, BRP certified technician or qualified to give you expert legal advice about how to solve this problem. What I've stated is my emotional opinion. This is the exact kind of problem I often run into with repair shops and greedy dealers and it disgusts me to no end. With that said, I'd also like to say there are a few good dealerships out there but are few and in between. They will continue to work with their buyers, verses slamming the door with a grin when you put the money in their hands!.....:rant:

 

[dlowings]

That was a great post snipe, I seen a lot of great take-aways... I never knew the BUDS would give a read out on the "boost pressure" . I think had a normal person knew that, he would have asked prior to taking it in to have the tech give him the "boost pressure" reading when he got it back.. Better yet, when these go into the shop to get serviced, is the technician required to keep any of the info from the BUDS so that later if there is an issue BRP has it on hand ? I work in data centers all day so hearing ANY difference in a super charged engine as opposed to a non SC engine I couldn't do it... I have two SC machines and all I know is how fast they go, as long as I can see 70 mph im good.... :rofl:

 

[seadoosnipe]

Bombardier Utility Diagnostic Software...?

That was a great post snipe, I seen a lot of great take-aways... I never knew the BUDS would give a read out on the "boost pressure" . I think had a normal person knew that, he would have asked prior to taking it in to have the tech give him the "boost pressure" reading when he got it back.. Better yet, when these go into the shop to get serviced, is the technician required to keep any of the info from the BUDS so that later if there is an issue BRP has it on hand ? I work in data centers all day so hearing ANY difference in a super charged engine as opposed to a non SC engine I couldn't do it... I have two SC machines and all I know is how fast they go, as long as I can see 70 mph im good.... :rofl:

I'm not quite sure of everything this software does, I'm not allowed to have it. This is one of the ways big business tries to knock out the shade tree mechanic. By developing systems that we can't work on....:ack:

These machines are totally computerized. I don't think half the BRP certified technicians know how to do anything but the basics. It's like navigating a computer. Only a handful of people know what BIOS is or how to navigate through the control panel or clearing CMOS. The world of diagnostics and computers continue to expand in what they can do by two fold every year.

The problem with this supercharger should have been picked up by the average mechanic. Without the software program, I would know whether or not his supercharger was building boost.

No telling what all has happened or what the mechanic truly did. I'm sure the owner was not there when he did the maintenance. I have learned that there is always extuniating circumstances in every complaint. Maybe the mechainc didn't get all the info from his supervisor and only did the 10 hour service. You never know. I do know, had I paid anyone for services I felt I did not get, the ski would be sitting on their doorstep and I'd be demanding them either return my money or repair it.

The worse part about being a consumer is, these guys know that they have the upper hand on the legality of what they are doing with their customers. As a business, this guy (the service dealer) might already know, the owner did not ask for any paperwork on what he requested, so have nothing to stand on in a court of law. We are just the ones wanting to have fun. There are many of the larger dealers who keep a lawyer on retainer. They are used to lawsuits, so they become law savvy on what they can get away with.

One word on dealerships. There are some very good dealers out there that want to make their customers happy. They want them as repeat buyers. They want them to tell their friends where they got their ski or got it serviced. But, they are out numbered by the greedy ones. The dealership category we have was just opened this past year, during the hard economic times. I don't think many are spending on advertising right now. That category was created for dealers to come in and post, advertise or answer questions for owners from their franchise.

I hope he comes to a happy solution with his problem but I fear this dealer he's worked with has crossed his "t's" and dotted his "i's". They usually do. And he'll have to convince the home branch of BRP, that he was taken advantage of, which is pretty hard. But, I do hope it works out to his advantage....:cheers: