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Looking at a Challenger X20....
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WAJetboating
Member
I don't know if there's a formal checklist, but inspecting any boat is pretty much the same.
Number One Rule: Don't buy it if you haven't driven it yourself on the water. Lots of boat engines run fine "on the trailer" but reveal problems once they're in the water because now the engine has a load on the impeller.
Another good and fast indication is the cleanliness of the engine compartment. It's easy to ignore because it's out of sight for most people. If that's been kept clean, it's likely the owner is conscientious and attentive to the other aspects of boat ownership - like proper engine maintenance.
Most of a sportboat's value is in the engine(s). It's really an engine that happens to come in a fiberglass wrapper. So pay attention to the engine. If the first two items above check out fine, go over the engine carefully. General cleanliness is a good starting point. Do a compression check on all cylinders (they should be within 5-10% of each other). Look at the spark plug electrodes to see how things have been going inside the cylinders. Look at the fuel filter(s); they're really easy to change, so if they're dirty and nasty the owner probably ignores all other maintenance too. Look at the wiring on the engine, checking for discoloration or other signs of overheating.
Check the fuel lines on the engine/carbs, and to/from the fuel tank. Cracking, splitting, drying out, brittleness/stiffness, etc. are all signs of neglect.
You're talking about a 2-stroke engine, but if you end up considering a 4-stroke you should sample the engine oil to check for contaminants, particulates, etc.
On the drive system, "dip" (stick a clean screwdriver into) the lubes at the front and rear of the impeller shaft. There should be no discoloration, no foam, no metal flakes, etc. Obviously examine the front and rear and edges of the impeller for any damage whatsoever. Check the wear ring around the impeller for nicks, gouges, any sign at all that anything but clean water has passed through the jetdrive. Check the clearance between the impeller and the wear ring - they should be tight with as little space as possible. Grab the impeller shaft and try to wiggle it in every axis; you should feel just the slightest clearance but nothing sloppy and no rattles.
Check the steering nozzle and the thrust reverser for smooth operation and any signs of damage, paint wear, etc.
Remember, if it's a jetboat then you're really inspecting a big, powerful water pump. Look for anything that doesn't appear proper for something that should be pumping water. Nicks? Gouges? Deep scratches? Those indicate something other than water passed through the jetdrive, perhaps rocks sucked off the bottom of the lake or floating debris that the owner didn't bother to avoid.
And I haven't even mentioned the rest of the boat. Obviously check the console controls, seat fabric, fittings, cleats, etc.
This should get you started. I would allow at least 2-3 hours to properly review a boat on its trailer. You will need tools to do it right. Take at least one additional person with you because multiple sets of eyeballs will see different things.
Report back!
WAJetboating
Member
This was a case of jetboats being more like regular boats. It's actually unusual for a boat's engines to be manufactured by the boat maker. Look around at virtually every other boat type out there. Do the boat makers build their own engines? No, they buy from PCM or Indmar or Volvo or Mercury or another of the marine engine manufacturers. Jetboats are the exception here, not the rule.
Having said that, which is easier to find: A Mercury engine shop, or a Rotax engine shop? Are there more certified Merc shops, or Rotax shops? Count up the number of places in your town that work on Mercury engines versus Rotax engines. Virtually any small town near any body of water will have a shop capable of working on Mercury engines. Can't say that about Rotax.
I'm not throwing rocks at Rotax engines. I own and maintain both Rotax and Mercury powered craft. But this argument that Mercury-powered Seadoo boats are somehow orphaned or unsupported is simply false. There is more support for any Mercury engine than any Rotax engine - check the Yellow Pages if you need proof.
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BMANN06
Well-Known Member
Umm yup ... let's see:
Mercury - Built in USA (or at least used to be)
Rotax - Built in Austria or spain ... somewheres over there?
There are some seriously small towns up here, like < 500 residence. Pass through these towns and you'll still see a Mercury Sign hangin from the Marina Bay door.
WAJetboating
Member
Seadoo produced boats with Mercury engines from 2000-2005. Before and after that, Seadoo used their own Rotax engines.
The Mercury engine and components used in the Seadoo boats were also sold to other manufacturers, including Sugar Sand (a direct competitor to Seadoo in those days). They are V6 outboard engines with the lower unit removed and a jetdrive bolted on instead. Obviously, Mercury also sold them as standalone outboards for years and years.
As a result, there are literally tens of thousands of these engines in service today and a healthy infrastructure of parts, service, and support for them. They are so popular that recently I have even started to see third-party companies offering aftermarket replacement parts for things like their high pressure fuel injection pumps, voltage regulators, rev limiters, etc.
On this site, we have repeatedly summarized the "Mercury vs. Rotax" debate as follows:
* Mercury engines are more reliable and more expensive to fix.
* Rotax engines are less reliable and less expensive to fix.
I have and maintain both. Both are great engines and serve their purpose in their respective niches. I am glad to have a Mercury engine in my jetboat and Rotax engines in my jetskis.
biffdotorg
Active Member
Here are some more specific items to ask about if you are considering the Challenger X, which I am the proud owner of from my purchase this past fall.
Ask what oil they used in the engine. If it is the 240, then they should have used Mercury Quicksilver Premium Plus. If it is the 250 Optimax, then they should have used the Quicksilver designed for DDFI engines.
On that vintage of Challenger x/X20 watch for these items:
1. Check the tower and it's mounts. All bases should be solid on the hull and not loose at any point
2. Check the hand bolts that are pulled to tip the tower down. They should be able to be tightened, yet be able to be loosened by hand. You would hate to have to use tools each time you came to a low bridge or had to put it in the garage. Many have lost the hand-bolts (have knobs on them)
3. Check that the front of the tower still has the pad attached before tipping the tower down. It will chip the gelcoat on your bow
4. check the rear deck vinyl for rips or cracking. When towed without a cover, it tends to balloon up and may rip
5. Check operation of all lights. If any fail, the fusebox is under the captians side pod box.
6. Ask the owner when the fluids were changed in the pump. There are two locations for fluid change. Someone can chime in with the names, but one will cause stator damage if not changed on a regular basis. Most will recommend annually with winterization for us northern folk.
7. The Challenger specific trailer does have a surge brake, so it should be tested.
8. There should be bearing protectors on the hubs as well, but ask about annual maintenance.
I have the Merc 240 and I am loving it so far. Check your local dealer to see if they have any issues with it. Both my merc dealer and Seadoo dealer had no issues. My BRP dealer actually has one mechanic that specializes on Rotax and one for Merc. The service writer knew all the maintenance and gotchas and recited them to me over the counter. That worked for me!
Good luck, it's a great boat and you will find it is a nice balance of performance and capacity and generally a good buy for the person that wants to get 5-7 people out on the lake!
Ask what oil they used in the engine. If it is the 240, then they should have used Mercury Quicksilver Premium Plus. If it is the 250 Optimax, then they should have used the Quicksilver designed for DDFI engines.
On that vintage of Challenger x/X20 watch for these items:
1. Check the tower and it's mounts. All bases should be solid on the hull and not loose at any point
2. Check the hand bolts that are pulled to tip the tower down. They should be able to be tightened, yet be able to be loosened by hand. You would hate to have to use tools each time you came to a low bridge or had to put it in the garage. Many have lost the hand-bolts (have knobs on them)
3. Check that the front of the tower still has the pad attached before tipping the tower down. It will chip the gelcoat on your bow
4. check the rear deck vinyl for rips or cracking. When towed without a cover, it tends to balloon up and may rip
5. Check operation of all lights. If any fail, the fusebox is under the captians side pod box.
6. Ask the owner when the fluids were changed in the pump. There are two locations for fluid change. Someone can chime in with the names, but one will cause stator damage if not changed on a regular basis. Most will recommend annually with winterization for us northern folk.
7. The Challenger specific trailer does have a surge brake, so it should be tested.
8. There should be bearing protectors on the hubs as well, but ask about annual maintenance.
I have the Merc 240 and I am loving it so far. Check your local dealer to see if they have any issues with it. Both my merc dealer and Seadoo dealer had no issues. My BRP dealer actually has one mechanic that specializes on Rotax and one for Merc. The service writer knew all the maintenance and gotchas and recited them to me over the counter. That worked for me!
Good luck, it's a great boat and you will find it is a nice balance of performance and capacity and generally a good buy for the person that wants to get 5-7 people out on the lake!
igneous
Active Member
Thanks biffdotorg...
went ahead and picked up boat for 3k. Not a bad deal but it was a repo and needs some tlc. No tower installed, but all hull/top areas look good with no soft spots or signs of fiberglass work. Went ahead and ordered shop manual for it. It does have one spot where the gelcoat is knocked off and glass is showing...very small though and good practice for me to learn gc repair (most of boat is white, which is good). All lines, hoses look new and all electrical/blower/bilge pump work. I'll be back to update and get advice once the weather gets warmer and I can get it out of garage. Thanks for all replies and info, great forum w/many knowledgeable folks.
went ahead and picked up boat for 3k. Not a bad deal but it was a repo and needs some tlc. No tower installed, but all hull/top areas look good with no soft spots or signs of fiberglass work. Went ahead and ordered shop manual for it. It does have one spot where the gelcoat is knocked off and glass is showing...very small though and good practice for me to learn gc repair (most of boat is white, which is good). All lines, hoses look new and all electrical/blower/bilge pump work. I'll be back to update and get advice once the weather gets warmer and I can get it out of garage. Thanks for all replies and info, great forum w/many knowledgeable folks.
WAJetboating
Member
For $3000 I'd buy it in a heartbeat, as long as the engine is in good shape!
Huh? The X20 was Seadoo's wakeboat, it came from the factory with a waketower. Are you sure this is an X20?
igneous
Active Member
Yes, it had a tower as there are two 1" holes on each side. No biggie though, as I can always install one later. Think the wife wants a bimini before a tower, since the pull up rod for tube/skiier is in good shape. We aren't young enough to wakeboard, but we may get one for my 15 yr. old for this summer. I figured it'd be a good project for just 3k, even if I have to rebuild it and spend another 3k+.
Question...it has gas in tank, but I'd like to drain it and get fresh...what's the easiest way?
Question...it has gas in tank, but I'd like to drain it and get fresh...what's the easiest way?
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WAJetboating
Member
Warning: Do NOT tow inflatables from the ski pylon on this or any other boat. Use the towing eye, on the transom just above the swim platform. The transom is strong enough to withstand the stresses. The ski pylon is not.
There is no drain hole. You will have to syphon it out. I would disconnect the fuel line that runs to the engine and connect a gasoline-safe pump. It will take a while but involves minimal disassembly of fuel tank components.
Wow, $3000 is an awesome deal. Post up some pics.
canadianwhiskey
New Member
Sea Doo went to Merc because their engines kept blowing up. I know. I replaced 2 in a 4 yr period. I guess they got that sorted out because they seem to be a lot better now. I personally wanted a merc because of the previous experience with Rotax.
WAJetboating
Member
My standard advice to all buyers of Mercury SportJets is to perform a complete winterization service on the engine and the jetdrive. Will take you ~3-4 hours and cost ~$100-150 in supplies. When you're done, you'll KNOW that all fluids and maintenance components are in good condition, you'll have done a good review of the systems, and you'll be much more familiar with your new purchase.
Here's a link to winterizing instructions for the engine:
http://articles.richardhartman.net/jetboat/mercury240efiwinterization.htm
...and the jetdrive:
http://articles.richardhartman.net/jetboat/mercurym2winterization.htm
Hope this helps!
WAJetboating
Member
Seadoo switched back to Rotax when they finally developed a four-stroke engine (the 4-Tec). All Mercury SportJets are two-stroke engines, although the 240EFI and especially the Optimax versions have exceedingly good emissions performance (2-3 CARB "stars", enough to be treated like four-strokes on Lake Tahoe for example).
igneous
Active Member
I picked up a comp tester at auto store, but need to know which fuse(s) to pull to disable fuel system. Also, which is the best way to route spark to ground? Remove 1 plug at a time and ground to block or unplug another fuse?
Ordered manual online, but haven't got it yet. Thanks for all the replies ;^)
Ordered manual online, but haven't got it yet. Thanks for all the replies ;^)
OfficerSeaDoo
New Member
I guess I'm one of those guys that has to disagree with you. 2 strokes are powerful enough to whip you around and very inexpensive to replace (at least that's what I've seen with Rotax). I'm a firm believer in them. However, I don't know much about the 2 stroke Mercs.
WAJetboating
Member
Don't worry about disabling the fuel system. You only want to crank the engine a couple of revolutions per cylinder anyway. When the engine is next started, it will run a bit rich for the first ignition - which the ECU does anyway to improve starting (the injector pulse width is tripled during crankup).
There is no provision for grounding the spark plug leads, but you don't need to anyway. When you're cranking for compression test, leave the safety lanyard disconnected. The engine will still start but the safety switch will disable the CDI's on each spark plug. No spark will be generated, so there's nothing to worry about. (You want to leave this lanyard disconnected anyway because the engine will start and run even when firing on just three cylinders!)
WAJetboating
Member
The lanyard snaps onto a black pushbutton below the keyswitch. The engine will not start without it. It is like the lanyard used by virtually all jetskis to kill the engine if the rider falls off.
WAJetboating
Member
That's where the safety lanyard goes. It snaps over the button. The engine will only start if the lanyard is installed, so that the button is pressed IN. With the lanyard off/button out, the spark plug CDI's are disabled and no spark will be generated. You can crank the engine (and thus do your compression tests) but unless you hold that button down, or disconnect it behind the dash, the engine will not start.
Lanyards are available from Seadoo dealers, or online. You just need a "dumb" lanyard, as opposed to the DESS (electronic) lanyards that were used on jetskis from the mid-90's onward. You could use a DESS lanyard - they are mechanically compatible - but cost about 2X.
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