Finding a leak in 96XP

[scooper77515]

I have a leak somewhere. I have fixed the freeze plugs and verified that they are not leaking. Doesn't appear to be coming from the exhaust anywhere.

I took the seat off and put the nose into a fixed dock and ran it for a while looking inside the hull and cannot see anything obvious. The bilge pumps appear to be working, but not as good at they should.

I drove it without a seat for 10 minutes, and again, cannot see anything obvious.

BUT!!! I turned the engine off and put all my weight on the right side almost sinking the ski. Nothing. But when I put all my weight on the left side, I can clearly hear water bubbling in

Let it "fill up" which is about 1-2 gallons of water, and put it on the trailer and drove it home. Still had the 2 gallons water in it, and did not appear to be leaking from the hull...

Where should I start looking from here?

It is NOT the carbon ring, exhaust, does not appear to be coming from the rear, and sounds like it is coming from under the engine, maybe under the exhaust pipe. I am pretty sure (but not defintely sure) that it is not the coupler on the exhaust pipe. I could clearly see it from the front when i was running the ski against the dock.

 

[seadoosnipe]

Hmmmmm?

That's gonna be a tough one. Everything that I know of to check, you've checked. I'll have to pass on this one. I wouldn't know where to begin...

 

[scooper77515]

How about the bilges?

I don't want to have to pull the entire engine to find a leak.

Is there a suggestion for making the bilges work better? Mine work, but not very well. When I pull them out, shouldn't i be able to hear or feel some suction?

The leak could EASILY be overcome by the bilges if they worked efficiently.

My bilges have the o-rings out by the jet squished through the cracks so I can see them. Will that affect the efficiency of them?

Plenty of water is shot out of those two holes when running, so I would guess there would be PLENTY of vacuum to make the bilges work.

I have shot air through them and they seem to be clear and free flowing.

 

[Wheels & Waves]

Looks like you have covered most of the bases on this. There is one other place you could check. Make sure your siphon tubes are still in the venturi of the pump. If either of the tubes are gone, you can get water forced back into the ski. The tubes are designed to place the bilge system in the highest area of negative pressure of the pump. Without them, the pump can actually push water back into the hull. As far as the bilge o-rings, if you can see them pinched out of the edge of the pump, replace them. Also check that the bilge hoses on the inside of the hull are routed up under the seat mount post and then back down to the bilge pickups. This acts as an air gap in the system.

 

[scooper77515]

W&W...I think you may have something there...

I know the tubes run up to just under the seat, but when the engine is running, the tubes are full of water except for a couple of bubbles. That should mean that they are sucking well and should keep the hull empty, but they arent. I wonder if the water is coming from there...

I will pull those o-rings off and replace them, and make sure the hoses are routed correctly, and try it again.

Cool thing about "testing" this ski is that I get to ride it for an hour or so each time. And it is a TOTAL BLAST!!!

Be nice if I could get the license sticker on it before I get busted...

 

[seadoosnipe]

License!

I know about the license thing..........from experience, those guys on the water should be given a patrol car, there'd be no more crime in America!....
I met the unfortunate end of one of their ink pens this past season for my fire extingusher.........costly!
Good advice Don!........I hope that solves the problem!

 

[Wheels & Waves]

Scooper...
Be sure to check if the siphon tubes are still there too....they are #23 in the fisch pic. If you can't see the pic, here's the link.
http://216.37.204.206/wps/seadoo_oem/Seadoo_PWC.asp?Type=18&A=35&B=18&Action=O

 

[scooper77515]

Yeah, those are still there. That is why I know the water is coming out the jet. I stuck my hand in there (I know, I don't need a lecture) and felt the two separate streams coming out. I just don't think they are pulling the vacuum on the bilge thingies in the hull like they should.

Thanks for the pic, that should help me rebuild and/or troubleshoot the bilge system.

 

[sunk1]

scooper
Do you have VTS? If you do check the flex boot on the VTS Rod outside the Hull. They dry out and crack and you can't really tell by looking at it you need to feel it with your fingers. Also that grate under the ski bolts through the hull. I have a GSX and I don't know if the XP is similar.
Good Luck

 

[Wheels & Waves]

If the VTS rod boot is leaking, you will more than likely short out your VTS housing. This boot keeps water from traveling up the VTS rod and entering the housing. You could, however, have a leak at the thru-hull seal for the VTS rod. Check the nut on the outside where the VTS exits.

 

[scooper77515]

The VTS leaked with the previous owner. It is shot. I replaced that boot first thing. But left the VTS not working at the current time (that doohicky is EXPENSIVE:ack. It appears that it leaked but the water, most if not all, was stopped in the VTS box. Nothing else appeared to be wet, but the entire VTS is rusted solid.

I can see the bolts from the bottom grate coming up through the bottom and will watch those in a dry boat to see if they are leaking. Might slap some grease over them and lay some fiberglass over those areas, or silicone.

Still haven't checked the sponsons (fins on the side) as requested in another thread. I should have the new carbs delivered today and will be able to do some work on it. Haven't touched it in a week waiting for the parts.

I also replaced the o-rings in the drain tubes out by the jet...

Need to put the carbs in and get it back in the water and start checking stuff.

 

[wookiemail]

Water Leaks

I'm dumb about boats. But when our '94 was leaking,
I hauled it onto the trailer. I could see where the water
was leaking OUT, generally. This gave me an idea: Why
not put the thing where it was convenient to work on
and fill it with some water? Then check on the outside
and see where it's coming out.

Water is reciprocal so it was helpful.

Bill Hale

 

[scooper77515]

I was hoping that it would leak out when I put it back on the trailer, but it didn't leading me to believe it was being drawn in from the bilge pump system or a higher location (maybe the sponson-thingy bolt holes?).

 

[wookiemail]

As I remember, those sponson thingy bolt holes
were where mine was leaking. bh

 

[scooper77515]

The sponsons are my next focus for the leak...

it is a pretty fast leak. Fast enough that the bilge pumps cannot keep it cleared out. So I am thinking it is either an issue with the bilge pumps or a sponson leak that is big enough to overcome the bilge "suck-ability"...

 

[scooper77515]

Found some new information today

I finally met the previous owner and he mentioned that "it might leak a little, so be careful..."

He said that a couple years before it quit running a buddy of his was driving it and hit another guy on another ski. It didn't damage mine visibly, but put a nice hole in the hull of the other ski. He said they were coming toward each other and both turned at the last minute in the same direction and hit nose-to-nose sorta at the side, like at a 45 degree angle.

He said it leaked ever since, but he could never track down where it was leaking from...

Does this new information change the approach to looking for that leak?

 

[seadoosnipe]

Not really.....

It kinda sounds like you got some pretty good info on where to look and what may have caused it. Not really being that familar with the hulls on a ski, I will assume that they are split hulls, like a boat. You got the bottom half and the top half. The area where the hulls come together, is usually where your rub rails are. So if the seam was damaged in that collision, you may not see it because of the rail.

 

[scooper77515]

I took it out again yesterday (the new/rebuilt carbs work GREAT!) and verified 2 things.

1) it IS leaking from the left somewhere, and sounds like it is coming from the seam where the two halves of the hull come together. I can sit on the left foot hold and push down and when the seam comes into the water, I can hear a strong trickle. Cannot see it because there is a big piece of foam in the hull right there.

2) the carbon ring is leaking slowly. Shoots a fine mist of water out, but slow enough that it the bilge system should be able to EASILY compensate for it.

3) the bilge system does not appear to be working properly. It should be able to get the water out faster than either of these two leaks could fill it up.

Doing to pull that seam off and seal it from the outside, live with the carbon ring for now, and start a new thread re: optimizing the bilge system.

 

[scooper77515]

Overhauling/Optimizing the bilge system in XP model

If you have been reading my other thread, I have a couple of slow leaks that the bilge system should be able to compensate for but seems to be failing to do so.

So, should the bilge system be working whenever the engine is running, even at idle? I put the nose of the boat against a dock and revved it and it has some bubbles moving around slowly in the lines (up and down, not all in one direction), but doesn't appear to be pulling any strong vacuum. I pulled the bilge "boots" out and tried to see if I could feel a vacuum, and put some water in my hand and tried to have it suck it out but it didn't do it enough that I could feel or see it.

It seems like a pretty simple system, so what can I do to make it work better to keep the boat dryer?

I know that if these two things were sucking like they are supposed to that it would appear that I was taking on less than 2 cups of water at the end of the day.

 

[D 5UPE]

My Xp takes in water during wave jumping.
But I find it empties really quick if I give it some flat out action up the coast now and then.
I also found when my craft was a hose down, due to it melting on the exhaust.
It filled with water really quick.
Theres also a couple of rubber seals from hull to pump on these.
Maybe there missing or perrished.

 

[seadoosnipe]

Venturi!

Scooper, the bilge (bailer) lines are connected thru the hull to the venturi nozzles that work as the pump is running. If you are not getting a vacuum, you need to do a couple things. On your bailer lines, find a way to put the water hose to them and blow outward to the pump end. These ports have two holes and if a twig or something blocks one of the holes, the venturi effect is lost. And like Dave said, if your rubber seals at the hull, and there are two "0" rings between the nozzle end and the pump end are missing or broken, your sucking air. With air being the less denser of the two, you'll move more air than water.
If you do a google search on venturi pumps, you'll get an easy understanding of how that system works.

 

[scooper77515]

I just replaced the o-rings at the back. Didn't know about the other seals.

By the way (hope I am not getting off topic here) I one or maybe two clear lines running to the front of the boat, and appear to come out in little black holes out the sides, just under the rubber "bumper". The rear end of the hose (the only one I see is on the right side) is just laying in the bottom of the boat.

Is this part of the bilge system? Is it supposed to be hooked to something at the back? I cannot find it in my book because I don't know what "system" (ie. carburation, drivetrain, etc that the chapters are labeled) they belong to.

I was just wondering if this may have something to do with the bilges not working as I think they should.

I will try to run water through them and see what happens. I ran air, and it seemed a little constricted. Hard to tell not knowing what bends and valves, etc it may be running through from the bilge "boots" and the tail end of the bilge system...

 

[scooper77515]

So, technically, if the bilge system is working as it should, I should be able to go wide open for a couple minutes, and immediately shut down and pull off the seat and there should be no water in there...

 

[seadoosnipe]

Yes!

Yes, if your wide open and you have a little leak, you should be able to pull all the water out as it's coming in...........but really depends on how big the leak is.
In the manual, It's labled under "hull".....In the exploded view, it shows the hoses coming in thru the hull and each line connecting to a 90 degree "T" then to your bailer screen.
In the front, it looks like your battery has a vent tube that has a check valve on it and the end of the tube connects to a thru hull fitting so explosive vapors don't build up in your ski.

 

[scooper77515]

Thanks!!!

Thanks for all the help. You guys are great:hurray::hurray::hurray: