Do our skis have alternators?

[aadams1278]

I have a 96 SPI. My battery was low and the engine wouldn't crank over so I put the charger on for a couple hours and was able to get it running. And then took it out today. I've done this a couple times in seasons past and taken it out for a few hours. I've never had it not crank on me after doing that but I do wonder if that's a bad practice.

Do our skis have an alternator like a car and as long as you get it running it'll charge the battery back up or not?

Additionally, if the battery is low, would that have any negative effects on the ski running properly? Such as, is it an electronic ignition system or magneto? I had some issues with the engine losing just a touch of power (surging) at WOT today. I noticed the gauges flicker at the same time on Some occasions. I'm wondering if this had something to do with the low battery? Or maybe spark plugs?

 

[crisso]

With the engine running,put a meter on the batt, terminals.it should read above 13 volts.A quick rev and it should go no higher than 14.5 volts.That will test you charging system.

 

[Dr Honda]

Yes... it should charge the battery when it's running.

As above... put a meter on the battery, and at 5000 rpm, you should have 13.5v to 14.5v.

A 96 spi has "Mag" ignition... but you have an MPEM (computer) that needs at least 10.6v to run. If the voltage drops... it will cut the ignition.

 

[Gamerse]

doc beat me, n/m lol

:cheers:
Ernest

 

[aadams1278]

Ok, i just did the voltmeter check and all seems well. At first it was steady below 13v at around 12.7 but after about 10 seconds and I revved it once, it stayed above 13v. Also, it does increase voltage some when revved a little. I didn't go to 5000 rpm because it's out of the water and with no cooling water. But I feel like charging isn't the problem now.

I'm hoping the "issue" was just a fluke thing resulting from the battery being very low pulling the voltage down, or maybe just spark plugs. Although they don't look too bad to me, I'm not a spark plug inspecting expert. Do notice the darker brown area on the inner white part of the picture in my hand. is this a problem? I don't think they're too old, a year or two at most. (The pictures really aren't the best at showing the actual look of the plugs, but it's the best i could do. The actual color on the inner part of the plug is a browner color than the black that it appears to be in the pictures)

The only other thing i'm thinking is the rusting/corrosion on the battery terminals. The wiring you see is the connector for my battery tender. It appears that most of the corrosion is confined to the screw heads and the battery tender connectors rather than the leads that go to the jet ski.

I'm planning to take it out again today or tomorrow and see if the full battery charge has resolved the "problem".

Comments on plugs, corrosion, or next step? Thanks for the responses so far.

 

[LouDoo]

I would definitely clean up the corrosion on the battery and apply dielectric grease. The spark plugs look O.K. considering they are the wrong plugs. You should be running BR8ES, which I think are a little hotter.

There's a spark plug chart in this thread, scroll down until you find it.

http://www.seadooforum.com/showthread.php?4151-Snipes-Korner...

Lou

 

[aadams1278]

Hmmmm... interesting catch, good eye! I have changed the plugs before but just replaced them with what was already in there. I never thought to check to make sure they were the right ones. I bought the right ones today.

Thanks for the other tips. I'll attend to that battery.

 

[Gamerse]

You should be running BR8ES, which I think are a little hotter.

There's a spark plug chart in this thread, scroll down until you find it.

http://www.seadooforum.com/showthread.php?4151-Snipes-Korner...
Lou

BR8ES is correct, NGK scales backwards, the lower the number, the hotter the plug. If you ever have questions about whether a plug is hot or cold, look at the insulation on the electrode. The less there is "the deeper it appears to be" the hotter the plug is. Ref this page if you need more. http://ngksparkplugs.com/tech_support/spark_plugs/p2.asp?mode=nml

Try running some 8's and compare. The main thing is to use "R" type plugs, non-resistor plugs will drive you insane with all kinds of random problems.

:cheers:
Ernest

 

[Minnetonka4me]

sounds like your battery is pretty weak. Also....If it sits for weeks in between you should disconnect the battery if you want it to start the next time.

 

[aadams1278]

About the battery, I've never had this issue before of it going that low for just a few weeks between uses. During the riding season it has always been fine. After the winter I was needing a new battery every year because it wouldn't even take a charge but that's why I got the battery tender. I expected/hoped it would be the end of my battery issues. I've used it for 2 winters now and it's starting to do this. I considered that maybe the tender had worsened the battery instead of helped. I guess after 2 winters that puts the battery on its 3rd year which from what I've read this week is nearing the end of its expected life. It's a cheapo too and probably not even a jet ski specific battery (dont remember) so maybe its time is nearly up. Now I'm starting to hear of desulfator battery tenders and thinking maybe I need one of those to yield the best life from my batteries which I'm so tired of buying by now. I wish I had heard of that 2 years ago when I thought the battery tender (deltran) was the best thing since sliced bread.

 

[crisso]

The s/plug in the r/h photo looks very oily,even up along the threads.was this plug loose?

 

[Minnetonka4me]

LOL on the chargers...yup I was using the same thing until I got my hands on a Optimate 4 charger. I bought one b/c I had a bunch of batteries out of parts skis that my tender wouldn't even try to charge. This thing paid for itself in the first few batteries and has kept my cheap batteries going more than a year.

I just had one causing all sorts of issues while running...I tore it all apart just to find out it was a weak Walmart battery.

Optimate 4

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Program 1 (default setting on this model) desulfates, charges, tests and maintains the battery directly with the 2 supplied accessories – SAE-71 permanent ringlet connector with weatherproof cap & SAE-74 set of battery clips (see pictures to the right).

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Warns you of battery problems! Hourly battery condition tests monitors the battery and the current drain by the vehicle circuitry; a problem is indicated on an easy to understand light display. Or use the 10 second test at connection for a more hands on diagnosis of battery condition.

 

[aadams1278]

No, neither of the plugs were loose. There is a bit of oil on the threads but I didn't consider it to be a problem. should I? Is that an indication that the threads are leaking or something?

I heard someone say that you're not supposed to remove/install spark plugs when the engine is hot because the threads in the head are softer and you could strip/damage them. Anybody got any insight on this in relation specifically to our jet ski engines? I read a thread on plug reading that would seem to contradict this theory.

Also, having only recently gotten started doing my own maintenance, how tight are you supposed to install spark plugs? The not so clear picture on the box seems to indicate 1/3 to 2/3 turn after it gets seated. My old plugs were tight, hard to break loose, but putting the new ones in I felt like I might strip it because it kindof kept turning with not a lot of increased resistance, up to perhaps 1/2 turn. Rather than push it, i just left it at "snug-ish"

Below is old plugs (top of box) and new plugs after 1 run of about 30 minutes. The new plugs seem to make the engine run with a smoother sound and a little less hesitation off the standing start and rev up. I'm thinking this is a good thing.

 

[LouDoo]

Officially spark plugs are torqued to 17ft. lbs., I just looked it up. They should be tight but not too tight. I know that's an ambiguous statement but I think most people will know how tight.

Lou

 

[crisso]

It looks like that spark plugs compression gasket was cactus.Check it to a new one and you'll see the diff.New plugs now so don't worry about it.

 

[aadams1278]

does this compression gasket have to actually be compressed a little bit when the plugs are installed new for the first time? I know that sounds kindof redundant but would that explain some of the "it's still turning but not getting tighter" I described above? I'm familiar with this concept with glow plugs on RC airplane/Helicopter engines, you've gotta get it relatively tight so the copper(?) washer compresses and it won't come out, but this is a bit different. Also my concern for stripping threads stems from the RC hobby as well, where all the parts are much smaller, and possibly a lot more likely to strip than in a case such as this.

Thanks for all the help so far guys. I know the thread took quite a turn away from alternators.

 

[LouDoo]

Yes the washer compresses when you install the spark plug. If you're concerned about how much compression just torque them to factory specs. 17 ft. lbs.

Lou

 

[crisso]

:agree: Cousin Lou is 100% correct
The copper washers you know ,actually bend and conform to the shape.these ones compress

 

[LouDoo]

Thanks Cousin Criss. How are things in the land of Oz?

Lou

 

[crisso]

COUS" How are you!Things are very good.Busy at work.Got a few days off so having some r&r.Might go for a ride tomorrow(thursday or Wed. for you,but not if it's tomorrow.The flux thingy)god where is that delete button.So if I do,do you want me to post a photo?
AADAMS.Hope all is going ok with your ski

 

[aadams1278]

Yeah everything seems fine. Its just I've had it for a long time and it's getting old. I'm really enjoying it and have found it to be more fun to ride (maneuverable/able to cut up with) than newer 4 strokes (too stable and the electronic rpm decrease when turning full left or right). But I'm afraid it's gonna quit on me around the next corner. I know jet skis to typically have a reputation of constant problems, yet I've been fortunate with this one. It cranks reliably every single time, extremely little playing with the choke, idles reliably, doesnt cut off on me, etc. Because of that, I hesitate to change ANYTHING, especially the carb, because it's currently working well (ain't broke, don't fix it). I hesitated to change the plugs but that seems good so far. I do think there's a tiny fuel leak somewhere on the carb but it scares the heck out of me that I'll ruin a good thing if I go messing with that.

All that being said, I want to try to take care of it so it remains operable in it's current condition. Despite any lack of attention/maintenance it may have had in the past. Such as catch little things before they really become a problem. Thus the forum membership.

 

[Gamerse]

I know jet skis to typically have a reputation of constant problems, yet I've been fortunate with this one.

Meh, it all depends on the owner. We have a 98 ZXI on its original engine. The most expensive part was a $150.00 stator. That was replaced because the previous owner spent alot of time on the shores of SC. After a pump rebuild, for maintenance, not repair, we just changed the spark plugs, maintenance it, and beat the hell out of it. Still has 120,125,120lbs compression. GPS 55mph.

The reputation in my town is, Jetskis are the most economical way to play. Tigersharks, and certain seadoo models have a bad wrap around my town due to ignorance.

Glad to hear you're having a good experience adams. Don't be afraid to wash that engine bay with some GUNK(R) brand degreaser. Then maybe you could find your fuel leak easier.

Good luck with your ski!

 

[aadams1278]

My dad had a challenger jet boat for a while when I was young(er). Brand new. Had problems with it just randomly cutting off during the middle of riding. Couldn't narrow it down to a specific thing that made it happen. We thought it was the DESS lanyard (which was new technology at the time) bouncing too much and losing a connection, so the dealer reprogrammed it. No joy, same problem. Replaced it, no fix. Eventually they replaced the whole engine under warranty. Still happened. It's not like it was unusable or anything, sometimes it happened and sometimes it didn't. It would go for a long time (several outings) and we'd think it was miraculously fixed...nope. He sold it after a few years because of it. I can tell you that wasn't a result of poor ownership. He's always taken very good care of his boats.

Anyone I've ever known that had any jet powered boat has had issues. In fairness, that's not a whole lot of people. Perhaps that and the jet boat being all "what I grew up knowing" is just what my first impression was and has stuck. That doesn't change the fact that I love them though. I'm wanting a stand-up BAD! Never even ridden one, but can't wait. Looks like it would be a blast!