Cracked 1997 speedster tail cone bolt holes... need an opinion

[scottmilkeway]

Well like it says I slightly cracked, or smooshed maybe is a better word, the bolt holes on 4 tail cones now on this boat in the process of winterizing the first time by overtorquing, the second time I was rushed by the incentive of making a quick 100$ by doing a job on my day off and ended up overtorquing them again -_- Anyways at this point the boat is completely stored for winter and I was wondering how big of an issue this could be if I took it out on the water as is? am I overthinking? I rtv'd the crap outta those suckers and if anything they are over tight... will they leak? has anyone done this too?

I just have this thought in my head of catastrophic failure and I really don't want that

Should I just buck up for my idiocity and buy 2 more tail cones for spring and make sure I torque them with an inch pounds wrench (lol) and make sure I'm not rushed when I do it?

Do they make metal ones that are just like stock? just wondering (probably cost too much)

I just feel like so stupid tearing it apart a third time

 

[Dr Honda]

If it's just cracked to the outer edge... it's probably OK, as long as you used some kind of thread locker on the bolts.

BUT.... Without a pic... it's hard to give a real opinion.

 

[Guest_User]

Well like it says I slightly cracked, or smooshed maybe is a better word, the bolt holes on 4 tail cones now on this boat in the process of winterizing the first time by overtorquing, the second time I was rushed by the incentive of making a quick 100$ by doing a job on my day off and ended up overtorquing them again -_- Anyways at this point the boat is completely stored for winter and I was wondering how big of an issue this could be if I took it out on the water as is? am I overthinking? I rtv'd the crap outta those suckers and if anything they are over tight... will they leak? has anyone done this too?

I just have this thought in my head of catastrophic failure and I really don't want that

Should I just buck up for my idiocity and buy 2 more tail cones for spring and make sure I torque them with an inch pounds wrench (lol) and make sure I'm not rushed when I do it?

Do they make metal ones that are just like stock? just wondering (probably cost too much)

I just feel like so stupid tearing it apart a third time

I feel that those plastic tail cones are junk. I`ve always had aluminum cones on other pumps and would also be interested in metal cones for the 140mm pumps. You can`t even reach the proper torque spec in inlbs. before it mashes the mounting tabs on the cones... after just one season with a pair of new cones and a few jet pump oil services they look like a hundred years old. and I`m no butcher when it comes to wrenching.
I purchased 2 new tail cones again and did the service and their put away for spring...

I suggest you just buy new ones if in doubt, by your post it appears so... you really don`t want to risk any contamination of water in the jet pumps... things could get worse in a moments notice, then your stuck... your better off using an Anerobic flange sealant like Loctite 518 or similar on the cone O ring and mating surfaces instead of RTV... Use a thread sealer for use with plastic on the cone plug. ie: ARP thread sealant.
get 2 new cones and a few O rings...

I`ve been getting replacement hardware at www.Boltdepot.com or Mcmaster Carr

good luck...

 

[scottmilkeway]

Thanks for the input and tips guys! Luckily I had kept the first ones I cracked and was able to get some pictures of em

The cones are 35$ all together and I still have the oil so its not a huge deal to do it again in the spring when I re install my seats and put in a 12v outlet. I'm just pissed that it couldnt be like every normal thing and just tighten and stop instead of smooshing :banghead:

https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B6kdtrjq1nZJZmo2azJEeTg5U0U
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B6kdtrjq1nZJTVk0NWx2R3VtQms
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B6kdtrjq1nZJb3c3bEtoc2lxZTQ
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B6kdtrjq1nZJVl9SdkJJZ1ItcUk
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B6kdtrjq1nZJcXdOLS1URW1BS1k

 

[Robj]

If in doubt you could always pressure test the cavity to see if it holds. I would replace them and remember the torque wrench is your best friend. I always use mine.

 

[Guest_User]

Thanks for the input and tips guys! Luckily I had kept the first ones I cracked and was able to get some pictures of em

The cones are 35$ all together and I still have the oil so its not a huge deal to do it again in the spring when I re install my seats and put in a 12v outlet. I'm just pissed that it couldnt be like every normal thing and just tighten and stop instead of smooshing :banghead:

https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B6kdtrjq1nZJZmo2azJEeTg5U0U
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B6kdtrjq1nZJTVk0NWx2R3VtQms
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B6kdtrjq1nZJb3c3bEtoc2lxZTQ
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B6kdtrjq1nZJVl9SdkJJZ1ItcUk
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B6kdtrjq1nZJcXdOLS1URW1BS1k

yup, those are toast!
Give Rob over at PPG a call for parts...
I can`t even get near the specified torque of 35 inlbs. without them squishing, more ad more again the next time they are serviced... so now I just tighten it well by hand and call it a day. remember to apply blue loctite (242) to the threads of the small bolts...

 

[smc0922]

Guys keep in mind that using a Nut driver (no ratchet or leverage needed) the average adult can do 100in/lbs..... I'd suggest getting a nut driver set and tightening them by hand a smidge more than spinning the bolts on by hand. 35in/lbs is really easy to surpass, specially if you are using a ratchet.

 

[scottmilkeway]

I guess I'll just re-order them and worry about it in the spring, thanks for all the help and various do's and dont's, Im definitely NOT GONNA USE A WRENCH this time to put the cones on, and maybe by spring I'll have an air ratchet so taking off the nozzles is a breeze :thumbsup:

 

[Guest_User]

I guess I'll just re-order them and worry about it in the spring, thanks for all the help and various do's and dont's, Im definitely NOT GONNA USE A WRENCH this time to put the cones on, and maybe by spring I'll have an air ratchet so taking off the nozzles is a breeze :thumbsup:

I just use a 1/4 ratchet and tighten opposite corners until snug enough... The anerobic sealant will also help seal. The important thing is to push the cone on evenly so the edge of the O ring does not get dislodged and get pinched, that would cause a leak...

I just can`t believe the cost of these O rings, there must be a cheaper source... although the OEM bag with part number is def BRP, it clearly says Made in China! wow...

 

[scottmilkeway]

Thats what cracked the new ones :/ I forgot the o-ring the first time and put it back on and it went on a lil crooked and cracked just ordered my new ones though and idk where your looking but where I found 'em the cones, o-ring, and all the insidy bits are 11 bucks each + shipping... (thats the real rip-off)

 

[Dr Honda]

I can't open the pictures. It's asking for a password.

BUT... From Pail Rider's response... I'm sure they are done.

When I put cone bolts in... I also use a "Nut Driver", and I normally coat the bolt in black RTV. Once it's cured... it will seal the bolts... and keep them from vibrating out. (if they get loose)

Remember... the bolts aren't being used to hold a seal together... it's just holding a part together that has minimal stress on it.

 

[Guest_User]

Thats what cracked the new ones :/ I forgot the o-ring the first time and put it back on and it went on a lil crooked and cracked just ordered my new ones though and idk where your looking but where I found 'em the cones, o-ring, and all the insidy bits are 11 bucks each + shipping... (thats the real rip-off)

wow, that`s a good price if you got new cones and the plungers/springs with the O rings and all for 11.00! that`s a steal of a deal!!!

where did you buy them???

I wish I still had my resources from back home, I`d ask my machine shop to whittle a few out... no doubt they would be pricey tho...

 

[Guest_User]

I can't open the pictures. It's asking for a password.

BUT... From Pail Rider's response... I'm sure they are done.

When I put cone bolts in... I also use a "Nut Driver", and I normally coat the bolt in black RTV. Once it's cured... it will seal the bolts... and keep them from vibrating out. (if they get loose)

Remember... the bolts aren't being used to hold a seal together... it's just holding a part together that has minimal stress on it.

Doc, The mounting tabs were smashed/distorted and from what I saw one was cracked as a result pretty good...

One other thing that would cause more stress when installing the plunger/cone is the pump shaft/torrington bearing from not being seated. Make sure the torrington bearing/thrust washer and shaft are seated properly prior to install. I`ve seen it where someone has pinched the cage and ultimately killing the bearing life.
If anyone is worried about proper torque or equal torque on all the bolts, then try a 1/4 in. beam type torque wrench...
I know my "clicker" type will kill the mounting tabs before it even reaches 35 inch pounds... weird...

 

[scottmilkeway]

Sorry about that Doc, not sure why you cant look at the pics, I had the privacy on my google drive set as anyone with the link being able to look at it, but I changed it to public if you still wanted to look.

Pale Rider, I worked my way around the internet searching high and low and came across a powersports place in AZ that had the cone kit... (they were probably confused when I mentioned winterizing)

http://www.parkeryamaha.com/seadoopumpconekit295500542.aspx

 

[Guest_User]

Sorry about that Doc, not sure why you cant look at the pics, I had the privacy on my google drive set as anyone with the link being able to look at it, but I changed it to public if you still wanted to look.

Pale Rider, I worked my way around the internet searching high and low and came across a powersports place in AZ that had the cone kit... (they were probably confused when I mentioned winterizing)

http://www.parkeryamaha.com/seadoopumpconekit295500542.aspx

scott, wow, wish I had seen that earlier I paid 2x that, dammit!
But I can say that PY shipping charges can be downright ridiculous...

good find tho!:thumbsup: