97 xp idle problems

[wholf09]

When I idel my xp fo more than 20 sec it will die, then I have to start it up 5

or six times befor it will stay running.What it will do is die then i crank it ,it

runs for 10 sec then dies and i will have to do it again until it stays running.It

also has a problem with acceleration when i push on the gas i have to ease

into it or it will die it runs great at high speeds and even at low as long as i

do not bring it back down to an idle.I am not sure if it is the low speed

screws that need to be turned or what.Also could the vent for the gas tank

have anything to do with it .I am asking because my ski sits low in the water

and when i idel the gas brether can sometimes go under water.Thanks for

your help.

 

[robin savell lloyd]

It sounds like you may have mutiple problems. If you are geting water in hull where your carbs are all most under water that is one problem. the other problem sounds fuel related give us more info :cheers:

 

[wholf09]

there never was water in the hull .It just rides low in the water .I do not know why. It just dies while i idel and it takes a coupel of times to start it.it runs fine while i am going fast and slow i just cant idel of pusr the gas to fast or it dies.

 

[wholf09]

or push the gas to fast sorry

 

[robin savell lloyd]

It sounds if you have a hesitation you will probbly need to rebuild carbs. :cheers:

 

[seadoosnipe]

Accelerator pump.

It sounds like the diaphragm in your accelerator pump is gone. You can check this, but you have to remove the top of the air box and the flame arrestor so you can look inside the throats of the carbs.

The accelerator pump is on the PTO side carb. When you start into the throttle, it rolls on a cam and a diaphragm begins to depress, sending a small jet of fuel into the throat of the carbs. Under the air box, you'll see one line, about 1/4" in size and will break off to a "t" in between the carb, then the other line will go to the mag carb. When you have this exposed, look into the throats to see a small brass jet, about 1/2" long, then, roll the cam on the carbs to see if a shot of gas squirts from it. If not, you'll have to replace that diaphragm. And my friend, it ain't cheap.

Check the accelerator pumps operation. If your lucky, it's o.k, you may have blockage in one of or both of those little brass jets. You can use carb cleaner with that little straw attachment to see if they blow clear. If the pump and jets are o.k., you may just need to sync the carbs or open the low speed screw a bit, but it sounds like accelerator pump to me.

 

[wholf09]

OK thanks alot I will try it.I just rebuilt my carbs on my spx and it was not to bad .I do have one question which carb is the pto and which one is the mag is the mag the one with the pluse line attached to it and is that the accelator pump where the pluse line comes out at.


Now when it comes the adjusting the low speed screw the manuel says to turn until a slight resistance is felt then back off a turn .My question is what is a slight resistance .I feel resistance just about the whole time i am turning them . The carb on the left its screw seams to get tighter with less turns,and dont even get me started on how the manuel tells you to sink it up.What i di is to lossen the idel screw soe the carb is closed i did all of the without the sync linakage attached then i started the motor and by hand opened up the other carb until the motor sounded right or atleast the point where it was running its best.I then attached the sync bar adjusted the idle .(does this sound like a way that it could be done ?)The only thing that i had a prob with was the low speed screws as i stated above how do I know where to stop turning them at? Thanks alot for all the help .

 

[robin savell lloyd]

It sounds like the diaphragm in your accelerator pump is gone. You can check this, but you have to remove the top of the air box and the flame arrestor so you can look inside the throats of the carbs.

The accelerator pump is on the PTO side carb. When you start into the throttle, it rolls on a cam and a diaphragm begins to depress, sending a small jet of fuel into the throat of the carbs. Under the air box, you'll see one line, about 1/4" in size and will break off to a "t" in between the carb, then the other line will go to the mag carb. When you have this exposed, look into the throats to see a small brass jet, about 1/2" long, then, roll the cam on the carbs to see if a shot of gas squirts from it. If not, you'll have to replace that diaphragm. And my friend, it ain't cheap.

Check the accelerator pumps operation. If your lucky, it's o.k, you may have blockage in one of or both of those little brass jets. You can use carb cleaner with that little straw attachment to see if they blow clear. If the pump and jets are o.k., you may just need to sync the carbs or open the low speed screw a bit, but it sounds like accelerator pump to me.

I need to remember that some of these carbs have Accelerator pumps.

 

[seadoosnipe]

Theres your problem....

Wolfe, theres your problem. You've set your carbs up wrong. Your accelerator pump may still be bad (if you have that model), but for the most part, it seems you've set your carbs up wrong.

You will have to remove the air box and flame arrestor. With both carbs attached to the engine, pto carb is the rear carb, mag carb is the front carb, adjust the idle set screw till it no longer touches the idle plate of the mag carb. The pulse line goes to the fuel pump on the mag carb. The accelerator pump (if you have it) is located on the side of the pto carb, attached to the side, nearest the jet pump.

Once you have the box and arrestor off and the idle stop screw backed off, look into the throats of both carbs. Are both throttle plates closed off to the same percentage? If not, your carbs aren't in sync with each other. Break that bar loose at the pto carb, by just popping it off with a screw driver. Then, if one of those carbs were open more so than the other, they should both now be closed. Re-adjust the sync linkage to that setting. You are suppose to measure the distance from each lock nut edge and adjust them out so to be even. After you've adjusted the sync, verify that when you put it on, that both throttle plates are still in the closed position. Roll the cam on the carbs all the way open with your throttle. Do they open all the way, evenly? If not, you will have to repeat the steps. The carbs have to run in sync. When you have them open and shut together, then your synced.

Turn your idle stop screw in, just till it makes contact with the idle stop on the mag carb idle stop plate. Then, turn the screw in, two fulll turns.

The low speed screws (you shouldn't have to adjust the high speed) should be turned in till they have seated. They say till you feel resistance because it's a needle valve and over tightening can damage that needle seat. But your description is that of, resistance of the spring. Turn it in till it's obviously closed. Very careful not to over tighten. Then open both screws to about 1 1/4 to 1 1/2 turns. Both have to be open the same amount. To expose these screws, you'll have to wind your throttle all the way forward to move the came plate out of the way so you can get to them with your fingers or a screwdriver (short handled).

After this adjustment has been made, you'll be required to check the oil pumps syncro to the carbs. There is a line you need to observe and set at 12 o'clock on the oil pump.

Good luck!.................:cheers:

 

[wholf09]

Sorry I think I confused you. I never messed with the carbs on my XP. The one that we are trying to fix.
I did that on my spx. I was just trying to figure out how to sync my carbs incase I had to for my xp.
What I was saying about the sync is that I did not unscrew the idle screw. I pulled off the bar
From The PTO carb and rotated the PTO carb by hand just a little bit until the motor
Ran as smooth as I could get it to run then I put the sync bar back on. That is almost what you where
Saying to do but I just synced them up at the idle instead of when they are closed because. my prob was
That when I did what you stated and unscrewed the idle screw and synced the two up it never seamed
To run as smooth as it does now I just did not understand it. I did all that on my spx just wanted to see
What you thought about it .I took it out and it ran fine it idles like it did before if I am remembering
Correctly. I just thought of something do I have to do the sync without the throttle cable and the ol
Pump cable connected?

As for my XP I will try to do what you have said I will let you know.

 

[seadoosnipe]

procedures....

The procedure in my previous post is for all twin carb model engines. I see the theory on how your trying to sync the carbs and logically, sounds like it will work. The only problem is that you don't know the throttle plates position at WOT. If you have one open all the way and one dragging, you may lean out a piston.

If you've tried the syncro instructions I printed above and you had problems, then you needed to make further adjustments to your low speed idle screws. Do you still have the plastic caps covering the "high speed" scews, which are on the top side of the carbs? How do your plugs read?

 

[wholf09]

OK I resynced my spx and it is idle ing alot better. Thanks


Now as for the xp I did what you said just one quick question the motor has

to be running when you are doing this right? That is what i did .I did not

notice any gas spraying out of the two brass fittings the fittings are the

ones that are on the bottom right of the inside of the carbs right? how much

gas should i see ? the ski idles fine out of the water but it will just kill

its self in the water if i idle it for to long or push the gas to fast I can push

the gas as hard as i want out to the water but not in it.I am going to go try

and spray it with carb cleaner next .Thanks for all your help.

 

[robin savell lloyd]

I do not believe engine has to be runing to see if Accelerator pumps are working. If they are I would back off on low speed screws and see if it helps at all. if not you will need to work on carbs. good luck :cheers:

 

[seadoosnipe]

That's it!

Well, this sounds like your problem. No, you don't have to have the boat running to check them. You should see a pretty good squirt of fuel from them into the throats of the carbs when you wind back on the throttle. But you'll only be able to do it once or twice before the gas is pumped out of the pump. Then, you'll still hear a air bubbling sound.

Before taking the accelerator pump apart, I'd disconnect the small, rubber fuel line from the elbow at the carb, then get some carb cleaner with the little red straw on it and see if you can blow through it. If it's clear, you'll see it squirt. You probably won't blow through it, if your thinking of that because in that elbow, there is a small, ball type check valve. The flow is only one way.

Check all the lines and fittings in this accelerator pump before deciding that it has to be replaced because if I remember right, the cost is just under $200 bucks for a new one. And the damn thing ain't no bigger than 1" square!

If you have the air box off and can see the pump on the side of the PTO carb, you can disconnect and remove it, only one or two screws holding it on. Then, remove the 4 screws that hold the diaphragm pump together (careful of the spring inside) and seperate it gently, so as not to rip it. I'd make this the last step, after you check everything else because if you rip that diaphragm, then your gonna be forkin out some bucks when it could be a line stopped up..........

 

[wholf09]

Ok here is what i did .I took off the hose that feed the brass jets and

started the motor and pushed the gas and nothing came out of the hoses I

took off the hose where it connects to the acc pump started the motor and

nothing came out of the little brass fitting from the diaphram pump. Also the

little check valve in the line should i be able to blow air through it? I cant

blow air through it either way I try.

 

[seadoosnipe]

No blow....

I thought I told you that you didnt' have to start the motor. Anway, you have to wind back on the throttle for the accelerator pump to squirt gas. You will NOT be able to blow through the lines that go to the brass fittings at the carb throats. The check ball is pretty rigid. You can use the carb cleaner to put up to it though and the pressure will go through it.

Either way, sounds like your next step is to remove the accelerator pump.

 

[wholf09]

Got it running thanks for all your help.Had to clean the pump and carbs.