240 EFI starting issues

[Striker4Hire]

Tony (Dr. Honda),
Hoping you can give me a little help, you certain have before!

I was actually going to ask this question on the tail end of another post, but after having to reset my password I can't find that post again.

My 2001 Challenger 2000 died on the water two days ago while running. Earlier in the day I had it sitting with the radio on and also inflated a large towable using the 12v accessory plug, so I had a concern about the battery being low. So, question #1 is: why is my battery not charging while using the boat? I have the M2 with the round cover that sits on top of the flywheel. No external belts.

I got it started again, but didn't make it very far before it quit a second time. I got a tow back to the dock and hooked up a charger. The battery was definitely low, but now, with a fully charged battery, the engine won't crank. The starter does spin up and engage the flywheel, but the flywheel doesn't want to turn. So, question #2: should I be able to manually turn the flywheel? Based on the spin of the starter it seems like I should turn the flywheel clockwise when looking down on the engine, but it won't budge. In some cases the starter gear will get stuck against the flywheel (similar to another post) but in my case I believe that's because the flywheel isn't turning and the starter teeth are grinding against it (there are some metal shavings present around the starter body).

Thanks in advance!

Jeremy

 

[Dr Honda]

Some metal filings/shavings around the starter is kind of normal. The gear isn't lubed (much) and it wears.


Yes... if you take the cover off, and have direct access to the flywheel... it should turn. You may be fighting compression... but if you pull the sparkplugs out... it should turn relatively free. If it doesn't... something isn't happy. Either you melted a piston... or the stator has come apart, and is jamming the flywheel. (That could be why it isn't charging)


So... I would take the sparkplugs out, and see if it turns. Also... take note of what cyl the plug came from, and look at the plugs. If you have a cyl that meted... you will see it on the plug. Either the electrode will be crushed (as parts went flying) or it will be covered in aluminum.

 

[Striker4Hire]

I think I'm just fighting compression, because it did crank one time in the last 10 attempts, but didn't start. The other 9 times the starter just hit the flywheel and stuck. Should I just keep trying? I'm a little worried about damaging the starter. Typically when it gets stuck, the shaft is bent at a slight angle as the teeth on the starter push at the tips of the teeth on the flywheel.

I can turn the flywheel a bit in the wrong direction, just not in the direction of compression.

 

[Striker4Hire]

I think I'm going to pull all the plugs (been meaning to replace them anyway) and attempt to crank at the flywheel. Will report back.

 

[Steves23]

Make sure you didn't suck up a rope into your grate and get stuck in impeller or around shaft

 

[Striker4Hire]

Okay, pulled all the spark plugs and one of them looked pretty bad. The electrode is bent down a bit and the plug appears to be covered in aluminum.

I can turn the flywheel in almost a complete circle and I hear the pistons working, but then it sticks, always at the same point. I can turn it the other way, almost all the way around and get stuck again.

While this is obviously not good, I'm confused by the initial failure. I was running just fine when it began to bog down and quit. The original failure screamed "low battery" - which after owning this boat for 3 years I'm very aware of. How do I go from that to a melted cylinder. All I did was crank the engine a couple of times.

 

[Striker4Hire]

Here is a picture of the plug.

 

[Dr Honda]

Wellllllll...................


that's not good. I think you lost a cyl. I'm betting if you pop the cyl head off... you will see a exploded piston.

What # plug was that?? (or location)

Also... look around the bilge. DO you see extra oil, and/or larger metal shavings?

Here's what I found on mine 3~4 years ago....

 

[Striker4Hire]

It was the lowest cylinder on the port side of the engine. Not sure what # that is. I didn't notice anything in the bilge. Pretty dry.

I tried to look into the cylinder but can't see much due to the location. What I can see looks the same as the other cylinders. The bad cylinder appears to be seized all the way out on the throw, with the head near where the electrode would be if the plug was installed. However I'm not sure that tells us anything since I've been twisting the fly wheel around.

Is it worth attempting to put a new plug in and cranking? Or am I looking at a trip to the mechanic at this point.

Thanks Tony,
Jeremy

 

[Dr Honda]

Nope... don't put in a new plug. It's locked up because of busted parts. AND... if it actually starts... it may get VERY ugly. Right now... you may get away with fixing one jug.


But don't take it to a shop. They won't rebuild... and they will tell you it's $5k or more to swap the powerhead. Pull it yourself, and see what the actual damage is.

 

[Striker4Hire]

Okay, finally back to my place (yeah the boat broke on day 2 of the vacay...) and around a reliable internet connection and tools. How do I get this started? If a repair or maintenance manual would be valuable just point me in the right direction.

Thanks,
Jeremy

 

[Striker4Hire]

My engine serial number is 0E387756.

 

[Striker4Hire]

Well, as I don't have the tools to pull the engine myself and rip it apart, I brought it into my local Merc shop. They bore scoped the bad cylinder and said that the piston was all jacked up. 20 hours minimum for them to do a rebuild, which they really don't want to do. $6k for a remanufacturing motor, fully installed, which is what they do want to do. Given the boat is only worth $7-8k with a good motor in it I'm at a bit of a loss...

 

[Dr Honda]

Yep... sorry about that.

Unfortunatly... you are paying as much for labor (or more) than the engine is worth. When you have to pay a mechanic... it's hard to afford an old boat.

BUT...

If the boat is in VERY good condition... and you like it... and were originally going to keep it... then do the new power head. That way, you will be good to go for the next 10 years. If you sell it now, it's not worth much, and if you buy another used boat... that engine may be short lived too.