2005 GTX 4 Tech Follow-Up

[georgeu]

Thanks for the help in diagnosing the hydro-lock on my ski. Been working on it since and using the shop vac, I sucked all the water out as far as I can tell. No matter how many times I turn it over without the plugs, nothing comes out and looking into the cylinders there is no water that I can tell. I've not removed the intake manifold (and would rather not) if I don't need to but I'm wondering if there's any other places I should check. Exhaust is clear of water, can't really see any other evidence of any. I've changed the oil (twice) so it no longer looks like chocolate milk. I've cranked the motor a while with fresh oil and no plugs, cranks fine. When I put the plugs back in, it's still struggling to turn over which makes me think there's something I missed.

Once again, any guidance anyone can give will be appreciated. Shop manual just says to basically take everything apart and I'd rather not have to.
Thanks again.

 

[ski-d00]

Taking the intake manifold off is not difficult, only 9 bolts, hose clamp, and some electrical connectors. It holds a lot of water and as soon as the manifold develops negative pressure from even just cranking it will suck water into the cylinders. I've rescued a lot of sunken skis and always remove the intake manifold (and dump out about a gallon of water) which takes about 20 minutes.

 

[georgeu]

While I didn’t want to go down that road, kind of felt that was what I needed to do so appreciate the advice. Hope it’s a nice day tomorrow as I know where I’ll be. Thanks for responding

 

[georgeu]

Taking the intake manifold off is not difficult, only 9 bolts, hose clamp, and some electrical connectors. It holds a lot of water and as soon as the manifold develops negative pressure from even just cranking it will suck water into the cylinders. I've rescued a lot of sunken skis and always remove the intake manifold (and dump out about a gallon of water) which takes about 20 minutes.

Spent the day taking the intake manifold off, some electrical connections is an understatement. It did still have a bunch of water in it so that’s all emptied now. Back together and I still have a hard time cranking the motor over. Oil level is good, I’m planning on doing another oil change after I get it running again. Really at a loss on where to look next.

 

[ski-d00]

How does it crank with the spark plugs out?

 

[georgeu]

How does it crank with the spark plugs out?

Cranks fine with the plugs out. The added pressure of having the plugs in results in this so that’s where I’m stuck

 

[ski-d00]

Have you load tested the battery?

 

[georgeu]

How does it crank with the spark plugs out?

Yes, initially (a few weeks ago) I got a new battery and thought it was bad so took it back and had it load tested and it checked out fine.

I took a video with no plugs and one with a single plug in #2 cylinder and will figure out how to post the link so you can hear. Pretty much the same sound regardless of which cylinder the plug is in. With all three plugs in it doesn't crank very much. Oil is milky again so I know I need another change but wanted to get it started and have it cycle through hot.

 

[georgeu]

Have you load tested the battery?

Here’s all three. Not sure how to make this more visible but today is the last day I can work on it for a couple weeks so was really hoping for something

 

[ski-d00]

Even with the plugs out it sounds like it has some added resistance. Is this supercharged? Have you pulled the pump and tried to turn the motor over by hand with a socket to see how much resistance it has? Do the wires get hot from cranking? Is your oil level below the low mark which makes sure you aren't overfilled?

 

[georgeu]

Even with the plugs out it sounds like it has some added resistance. Is this supercharged? Have you pulled the pump and tried to turn the motor over by hand with a socket to see how much resistance it has? Do the wires get hot from cranking? Is your oil level below the low mark which makes sure you aren't overfilled?

Thanks, it is not supercharged and I have not pulled the pump and I'm not sure I can/will do that. Wires do not get hot that I can tell but can check them shortly. Any particular wires to check? I assume you mean the battery wires. Oil level is fine but milky so will need another change (my third since this happened) but I wanted to get it running for a minute to let things cycle through before I change it again. Intake, exhaust are clear from what I can tell and I've sucked out the cylinders for a long time but I just can't figure out what is causing that. The ski ran like a champ before I hooked the hose up and screwed it up.

 

[georgeu]

Even with the plugs out it sounds like it has some added resistance. Is this supercharged? Have you pulled the pump and tried to turn the motor over by hand with a socket to see how much resistance it has? Do the wires get hot from cranking? Is your oil level below the low mark which makes sure you aren't overfilled?

I appreciate all your help with this. I'm leaving my cabin for a couple weeks and will be back up here over the 4th to try and nail this down so anything you (or anyone else) can think of, I'll work on it then. Thanks again.

 

[squared]

Here’s all three. Not sure how to make this more visible but today is the last day I can work on it for a couple weeks so was really hoping for something

I haven't read all of your threads, but when a ski gets swamped in brackish or salt water current continues to flow from the battery via all the connections. This includes the grounds, fuses, battery connections and anything else that isn't 100% sealed from water. In areas with dissimilar metals, it will develop galvanic corrosion which results in increased resistance later on. It also drains the battery if left swamped for some time.

Secondly, it's of the utmost importance that the engine be started and ran at idle as soon as possible to boil off the water. The oil and filter have to be changed, the filter housing cleared of water, and the intake drained if water is suspected to be in there. It's better to leave the engine full of water for a few hours or so than to drain it and let it set. I know the shop manual says to take the valve cover off and do a bunch of other stuff, but it's been my experience that taking too much time to clear out smaller amounts of water is not worth it, especially that which isn't in or headed to the combustion chamber. The reason being is flash rust builds quickly, and you don't want that on bearing surfaces, cylinder bores, rings, cam chains or valve train because you'll end up paying for it down the road. Oil will displace water, and if only run at idle, I'm of the opinion that you will not develop any galling of significance to damage the engine.

It takes 30 to 45 minutes of idling to boil all the water out, you can verify this by pulling the dipstick out slightly and watching the steam and (initially) boiling water roll out. A catch rag is valuable to wrap around this so that oil soaked water is not blowing everywhere. Since this is a Sea Doo, you're going to ruin the carbon seal by doing this if you don't either put the pump in a body of water or have some apparatus to direct cooling water to it. I've used this procedure on a number of skis, both two stroke and four stroke that have lasted over a decade for 100+ hours.

 

[georgeu]

I haven't read all of your threads, but when a ski gets swamped in brackish or salt water current continues to flow from the battery via all the connections. This includes the grounds, fuses, battery connections and anything else that isn't 100% sealed from water. In areas with dissimilar metals, it will develop galvanic corrosion which results in increased resistance later on. It also drains the battery if left swamped for some time.

Secondly, it's of the utmost importance that the engine be started and ran at idle as soon as possible to boil off the water. The oil and filter have to be changed, the filter housing cleared of water, and the intake drained if water is suspected to be in there. It's better to leave the engine full of water for a few hours or so than to drain it and let it set. I know the shop manual says to take the valve cover off and do a bunch of other stuff, but it's been my experience that taking too much time to clear out smaller amounts of water is not worth it, especially that which isn't in or headed to the combustion chamber. The reason being is flash rust builds quickly, and you don't want that on bearing surfaces, cylinder bores, rings, cam chains or valve train because you'll end up paying for it down the road. Oil will displace water, and if only run at idle, I'm of the opinion that you will not develop any galling of significance to damage the engine.

It takes 30 to 45 minutes of idling to boil all the water out, you can verify this by pulling the dipstick out slightly and watching the steam and (initially) boiling water roll out. A catch rag is valuable to wrap around this so that oil soaked water is not blowing everywhere. Since this is a Sea Doo, you're going to ruin the carbon seal by doing this if you don't either put the pump in a body of water or have some apparatus to direct cooling water to it. I've used this procedure on a number of skis, both two stroke and four stroke that have lasted over a decade for 100+ hours.

Thanks. Was on my garden hose, totally my fault. I’ve changed the oil twice and know I need another one. Removed and drained intake manifold, shop vac cylinders lots of times. Exhaust appears dry too. Getting it started to heat up the oil is where I’m having trouble. Still barely turns over when all plugs are in. Thanks

 

[georgeu]

Hey all. I’m back at it. Just did another milky oil change. No plugs in so turned it over a while to let it circulate. Still won’t even turn over with plugs in.