1998 XP limited Issue

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malibuman

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Hi guys, I'm pretty new to the PW world. I bought this xp limited about a week ago, and i got a great deal on it, it started right up, and ran fine on the trailer,
Well, we went to take it out today. There was some oil in the bottom of the hull, so i decided i didn't want to drain that into the lake, and i got a can of engine degreaser, sprayed it in the bottom of the hull, took a water hose and just flushed it out. after that i started it real quick just to make sure it would fire, and it did,
so we got to the lake, it would start, but would die right away, or if it didn't die right away it would die if tried to rev it up.

I'm a moron when it comes to these things, but i very mechanical,

Any help would be great!!!
 
Oil!

I think I read in a thread somewhere about oil in the hull. If I remember right, there is some kind of vent on the engine somewhere that can attribute to the oil in the hull.
As far as the engine running and dying, a little more detail would be great. What have you done so far. Take the plugs out to see how they are burning? Do a compression check? Are you using premix or the injection tank? Does the engine run well on land while hooked up to the water hose? If so, how does it respond to the throttle on land, running? When you goose it, does it respond pretty quick? If you haven't checked the compression yet, I think that would be the first place to look.
 
When i got it i asked him about it, and he said that he changed the oil in the premix injector bottle, and made a mess, and never cleaned it up.

when i got it it ran fine would start up on the trailer and rev no problems

when i got it to the lake it would start, and idle, Sometimes, but would die like the ignition was shut off or a something, checked for fuel flow, and it's got fuel pumping to the carbs,
Checked both plugs, they're both firing a nice blue spark

I have not done a compression check, but like i said, it starts up ok, but then dies pretty quick after that, i did have it start and idle on me and that lasted about 30 seconds to a minute, but that's was all i got out of it,
even once i took it out of the water it still does the same things, it will start and almost immediately die, hit the start button, start up, die, start up die.


someone told me you have to have the spark plug in the cylinder you are Not checking, is this correct?
Although i understand compression has LOTS to do with things, but it doesn't seem to me it would be a compression issue, or am i completely off base on that?
 
Compression?

I haven't heard the one yet about having the other spark plug in the cylinder while you test.
Kinda hard to trouble shoot when your not really there to hear it. You need to start fresh in trouble shooting and what you were told by the seller, keep it, but assume nothing.
Compression!...you can go by the auto parts store and get a compression tester for little or nothing. It's gonna be something you'll use fairly frequently on your ski when it comes to trouble shooting or at the end of each riding season. It's like a check-up for your engine. If the compression is good, then the heart is in pretty good shape.
You can actually have a ski hooked up to the water hose and while sitting on land, it will sound like it's running really good. But if the compression is bad in one or both cylinders, when you put it in the water and put the engine under a load (shaft torque), it will not have the torque to run the water through the pump. If it's bad enough, any strain (torque) on the engine will choke it.
I'd say check the compression for now, it's the first place I'd start....write back, let us know.
 
I have a compression tester, i do alot with atvs and motorcycles,

What should the compression be? and how differant can the cylinders be?
 
Pressure?

I'm at work at the moment and don't have access to the manuals, but I know it should be around 120 - 140 psi. If your over 100, then you should have enough compression to run. If there is 5 to 10 pounds difference, that shouldn't be to bad either. But if you got 130 on one cylinder and 90 on the other, then this may be of concern to the engine running good. Even compression THAT low, probably wouldn't cause the engine to die.
I've read threads today from some that may have a little more insight to this problem. Keep checking back, I'm sure someone will add another idea or two for you to check on.
 
The compression is a little low, it's about 90 on each cylinder,

but i went out this morning, and hit the start button, and it fired right up, but within a few seconds dies, hit the button, starts, dies, starts dies,

by listening to it it really sounds like the ignition is shutting off.
But i don't have a manual for the machine, and dont' have any spec's on what to measure or what the measurements should be.
 
Compression!

Most mechanics consider anything less than 100 psi as bad. The other thing, once the engine warms up, it's probably a bit less. I'm pretty sure it's suppose to be about 140 psi.
You say it sounds like your ignition is shutting down on you? That could be an engine sensor. You have the DESS I'm sure. When your engine goes down, are there any beeps? Try this, before attaching your lanyard cap, try pushing the start/stop 5 times. After the 5th time, you should hear an audible signal, one short and one long beep. Now, place your cap on and push the start button. If everything is o.k., the ski will start. If not, count the beeps and holler back at me.

I looked at the trouble shooting guide on the start, die, start die issue. There's a lot of things that can cause this. Weak compression is listed as is, the inline fuel filter and the carbs filter, water in your fuel, sheared flywheel key, incorrect rotary valve timing.

I'd say, if the ski was running well before, then check the little filter in each carb. Go for the small things first.

Hope this helps!
 
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ok, pushed it 5 times, got one short, and one long,
then nothing, if i pushed the button again i got 2 short beeps, but i don't know what that means,

When you say i have DESS, i have NO idea what your talking about

I also did pull a fuel line off and turned over the engine, and there was plenty of fuel coming through,
another reason i say it is ignition, (((at least that's what i'm guessing))

it's not that it runs bad when it runs, it only idles, if you touch the gas it dies, or accationally it would rev just a bit, but then completely die like i pulled the key,
Even tried to pull the choke out to in the process of all this, and that doesn't help. Doesn't seem like a fuel issue to me, but IDK for sure
 
Dess

The DESS stands for "digital electronic security system". The little black cap has a chip in it that is identified by the MPEM (multi purpose electronic module) and allows the machine to start. THe MPEM is the brain to your machine.
You missed a step in the instructions I gave you...what your doing is the advanced diagnostic mode for checking codes. Push the button 5 times again. Then you'll hear the 1 short, 1 long beep. When you hear those beeps, put your lanyard cap on and then again push the button again. If it starts, then the MPEM is fine. If it doesn't, you'll hear more beeps. Count them. Then tell me how many you hear.
You've checked the fuel so that doesn't seem to be the problem. If you pulled out the choke and there wasn't any change, then the pressure is probably good (suppose to be 5 psi.).
Check the mpem again and we'll go from there. :hat:

I just re-read this thread....you said there was some oil in the bottom of the hull and you also said that the compression was low (I know, the guy said he spilled it). This is an area of concern, I'll have to read a little more on that. At idle, on the trailer, what is the rpm's?
 
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i went back out there this morning, pushed the button 5 times, ,and now it won't beep at me, i tried it a few times, and couldn't get it to do it.

put the key on, hit the button and it fired off,

the idle i have moved it around seeing if that had anything to do with it, and where it's high, or low it didn't change anything, still start die, start die

but i think its around 1500 at this moment

the flywheel key seems like a good possibility to me, it will pop through the exhaust every once in a while like a plug is bad even though they have a good blue spark, i have a set i'll change them out if it stops raining here.

and back to the beeps, i don't have any idea why it did it last night, and now it won't this morning
 
Dess...

Yeah, try that again to see if you get any beeps. I have a trouble shooting guide for that advanced diagnostic mode. If you push the button five times and don't get a long and short beep, put the cap on and start it. Take the cap off and try it again.
With the backfiring, it does seem possible the backlash or tolerance in the rotary valve could be bad. That's a long shot, so I'd still look at other things first. :confused:
 
i tried again, 5 times, and nothing, started it a few times, took the key out, 5 times and nothing,
haha, i don't know what to do about that,
Only other thing i can think of if the dang beeper quit is put a small test light on it to see if it has went bad over night or not,
 
No, i don't get any beeps at all, no noise what so ever,
i was thinking about tring when i got home from work, but in the morning i'm thinking about unhooking the battery and then hooking it back up, see if that will make the beeper work,

i don't have any kind of a book on this thing, Is there any type of circuit braker that could be turning off and on? somebody mentioned that, but i wasn't sure....

what safety switches are there?

And i wanted to thank you for all the help.....
 
Strange

This is kinda strange. When you put your lanyard cord on, you should get 2 short beeps. This is a signal that your mpem and lanyard are correct and the mpem is ready for the engine to start. If your running, at idle and it just shuts down, like an ignition failure, then pull the lanyard cap and put it back on. Then again, you should get 2 short beeps.
I'm kinda stumped here, but I'm wondering if someone has tried to bypass the mpem's lanyard key. You did say the other night, when you pressed the start/stop 5 times, you got one short and one long beep. That's the correct signal to let you know your in the advanced diagnostic mode. Then you attach your cap and push the start button. If the mpem is o.k., then the engine will start. If not, there will be another set of beeps......2, 3, 4,..the amount of beeps can be looked up for trouble shooting. :confused:

BTW, look for an electrical box. It will be water proofed with wires going in and coming out. Your fuses are in there. Look to see if any are bad.

New idea!....just finished going over another post with someone having a problem that said his ski ran on land with a water hose but as soon as he put it in the water, it would die. He found out it was his pop off valve in his carb. May be something you can check.
 
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when i got home ((1am)) i hit the button 5 times, and got the one short and one long beep, and i put the cord on it, and it fired up, and then died like it has been.

but i didn't do it again to make sure, coz well, it's 1am...
I will check it again in the morning, hopfully it will beep for me..... but if i did it right, i didn't get any beeps.

When i put the lanyard on i don't get any beeps, infact, didn't know it beeped untill you told me so, and i read about it a little on here.

yeah, i seen that spot the fuses go, i will check that in the morning.

As far as a pop off valve, i don't know any idea where that's at,
 
Pop off valve!

It sounds like, from what you described, that your DESS is working fine. After pressing the button 5 times, you got the short and long beep. When you put the lanyard on, then pusth the start button, if all is o.k. with the MPEM, then it will start up. If not, you'll get more beeps that will lead you to a trouble code. You said it started, so that's a plus. Your mpem should be fine.
Next will be to work on your pop off valve in your carb. If it's not working right, it can keep your carbs from working correctly. I'm tired, I'll read your reply tomorrow and hopefully, we can look at a new approach and find something........:hat:
 
Carbs?

Outside the compression being low, I think your probably in need of a carb rebuild. If you want to take this further, I'd say to remove your intake and flame arrestor. When you have the carbs exposed, remove the allen head bolts that hold the PTO carb on. Remove the fuel lines and pop off the linkage. Careful not to change the adjustment on it. It has a lock nut on it, so it will probably not move. Then, look where your fuel goes into the carb, there is a plate, remove this plate and you'll see a small filter. Gently remove this to see if it's stopped up. Also, before going that far, you should have an inline fuel filter. Take a look there for trash and/or water. Let me know what you find!........:hat:
 
Advertise!

Sorry to hear of your misfortune with the ski. If you're wanting to give it up as a basket case, you can advertise on our main page. There's a section just for selling and buying stuff!.........
If I wasn't so far away, I'd like to give it a some serious thought!.....
You may also want to try ebay. Sea doos fetch a pretty good price there!
 
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