1995 XP refresh, new to this and have questions

[JUSS10]

So a few years back I "inherited" a 95 XP from my father in law. He owned it since 97 and essentially was sick of taking care of it as its was getting old and tired. That said, this ski is my wife pride and joy so I took it upon myself to get it running better when i first got it. Carbs came off and were cleaned and rebuilt, new plugs, new fuel likes, cleaned out some clogged fuel vents and in his words, it was running the best it had it 10 years. Thats great, until this weekend. Wife was out riding it and pulled up to the dock and said she barely made it. Figured it was out of gas as none of the gauges or warning lights seem to work anymore. Added some fuel and tried and tried. finally just pulled it out and worked on it on the trailer. Got it running but it seemed like it was only going on one cylinder. Called it a day. Next day i hooked up a compression gauge. Rear cylinder is dead, nothing. Pulled the head and sure enough, cylinder walls were scored pretty bad. Thinking we had an oil delivery issue. I did notice that it was low on oil (remember, no warning lights worked) so that could have been it, I also know this little oiler lines on the side of the block can go bad. ANYWAY, as of now the engine is out of the hull and I am trying to figure out what i need to do. As stated this ski is my wifes pride and joy so I would like to take this opportunity to fix it up right if I am going to have to rebuild the engine. Here is a list of what i know is wrong:

- rear cylinder is shot, engine needs a top end
- VTS is seized up from water
- water bailing system doesn't seem to work well
- fuel gauge doesn't work
- warning lights don't seem to work
- tach doesn't work
- rattles pretty bad at idle (installed anti rattle kit last year, didn't seem to help much)

So yeah. For starters, what am I looking for with the engine? I know it needs a top end. Was thinking of using Fullbore out of Alpena, MI. You send them the cylinders and they bore and match the pistons for you. Seems like a decent setup. What else should I do/look for while I have the engine out? Anyway to tell if it needs bottom end work?

I have found a few good write ups on the VTS issue so I think I can figure that out

I had made a fix to the water bailing system. the O rings in the pump nozzle were shot so I replaced those, just never ran it long enough to see if that really fixed it.

No clue on the electronic issues but I really want the low fuel and low oil lights to work again.

Finally the rattle. Like I said, I added the anti rattle kit to the pump a few years back which seemed to help. I'm thinking the rattle may actually be some loose bushings in the steering/trim nozzle setup. Otherwise, is there an jet pump overhaul kit that I should look in to? Or maybe it was never the jet pump at all and an engine problem... Really tough to tell when everything that moves and makes noise is stuffed down in a fiberglass hull that echos sound all over. ha

Sorry for the long post, I'm not new to engines or working on them. Have been working on 4 strokes for years and just recently rebuilt my old 85 polaris 250 which was a 2 stroke but seadoos are all new to me.

Thanks!

Justin

 

[Cliff787]

My advice would be to first identify WHY it lost the rear cylinder.

If you just rebuild it w/o identifying the root cause. You'll just be rebuilding the engine over and over.

You'll get real good at rebuilding it. But that of course isn't the point.

So look into the 3/32" oil injection lines, oil pump alignment, poor oil line clamp pressure(leaking), missing oil line clamp(s), plugged oil line coming from the oil tank etc.

If upon start up on the trailer the ski smokes like a freight train or has an uncontrollable high idle. The seals have failed on the crank and it will need a full rebuild(about $400 for crank & counterbalance shaft rebuild at $125)

Download the Shop manual for your ski and read through it to get familiar with the systems and subsystems on the ski. It will have the wiring schematics to troubleshoot the wiring as well.

I would go through all of the systems on the ski and correct them as needed for the reliability that you are looking for because if it was my wife or family member riding it. I would want it in tip top shape.

 

[JUSS10]

Thanks for the response.

I honestly think it just ran out of oil in the tank. Dumb mistake I know, like I said I'm a 4 stroke guy so its all new to me I guess. That said, correct me if I'm wrong, there is an oil sump system of sorts on these engines correct? I know there are the two large oil lines that went to either side of the engine block. So since the oil tank is higher than the engine, would have there still been oil in the bottom of the engine and the injector for the cylinders just went dry? Anything to look for when i pull the cylinders that can give me an idea of the condition of the bottom end of the engine?

On the trailer I don't recall it ever smoking really bad when I ran it. I would hook it up to the garden hose and run it when I was fixing up the carbs and it would idle high (which from what i read is expected as its not under load) but it was never like a run away idle. I do know what a bad crank seal is like (had one in a quad and I think my sled has one too that needs fixed) usually you have a high idle that you can't get down from and the throttle response is slow or sloppy. Not the case here. Both plugs were perfect if not a little too rich. If I'm not mistaken, a leaking seal will show a lean condition on the plug?

There were some loose oil clamps and I have no clue how old the oil filter was.

I'll dive in to the service manuals and learn the ins and outs of these things. Is there a spot on the site to get them? I saw something for premium members, is there a free download?

Agreed on reliability, this thing has scared me since day one of getting it. I knew it was on borrowed time and I'm kind of glad the cylinder went as now I can go through it carefully and make it reliable. I never felt good when I was on shore and she went out of site.

Thanks for the tips. will start to dig in more.

 

[DanSquires]

If you go the Fullbore route for the top end (the best in the business,) my recommendation is to go ahead and buy the full rebuild kit with (new) WSM crank, complete gasket kit, new seals, etc. etc.. I would hate to see that oem 22 year old crank break and take out your new top end.

yes, a leaking seal will show lean condition, typically on the rear cylinder.

 

[JUSS10]

If you go the Fullbore route for the top end (the best in the business,) my recommendation is to go ahead and buy the full rebuild kit with (new) WSM crank, complete gasket kit, new seals, etc. etc.. I would hate to see that oem 22 year old crank break and take out your new top end.

yes, a leaking seal will show lean condition, typically on the rear cylinder.

I know the feeling... I thought about that but thats a steep shift from $295 to $785... I know I know, if the crank goes, then it isn't one or the other, it ended up costing me both...

what about the jet pump, I'll get some pictures uploaded but the impeller is pretty chewed up on the front. Does anyone make an OEM jet pump rebuild kit of sorts (wear ring, shaft, bears, seals, etc)?

 

[DanSquires]

OSD has all of the bearings and both rubber and delrin wear ring, if the impeller is not fixable with a file then there are many aftermarket alternatives, sending yours off on an exchange for a refurbished one, or buy a nice used one from someone (I know I've got two minty impellers for a 95 xp 717 sitting in my stash looking for a home now)

As far as the engine, at the very least, split your cases, replace the seals and give the bearings a good spin and see what's up. If they're noisy, then you're probably going to throw good money after bad if you reuse it. If not, then at least you know and you've got new crank seals.

 

[JUSS10]

OSD has all of the bearings and both rubber and delrin wear ring, if the impeller is not fixable with a file then there are many aftermarket alternatives, sending yours off on an exchange for a refurbished one, or buy a nice used one from someone (I know I've got two minty impellers for a 95 xp 717 sitting in my stash looking for a home now)

As far as the engine, at the very least, split your cases, replace the seals and give the bearings a good spin and see what's up. If they're noisy, then you're probably going to throw good money after bad if you reuse it. If not, then at least you know and you've got new crank seals.

OSD? Sorry, new at this.

I'll get some pictures of the impeller tonight and post them up and see what you all have to say.

Good call on splitting the case and replacing seals, better now that the engine is out.

Justin

 

[DanSquires]

OSD? Sorry, new at this.

I'll get some pictures of the impeller tonight and post them up and see what you all have to say.

Good call on splitting the case and replacing seals, better now that the engine is out.

Justin

http://www.osdmarine.com/

 

[Kwik_uk]

Don’t worry about the pump rattle. It’s normal. It’s because there is play at either end of the shaft. When you’ve got it apart, make sure the rubber bump stops are on either end of the drive shaft. If not, buy some.
Talking of gauges - check the connectors from where the gauges go back to the MPEM. Look for anything that’s worn through. Also check the plug that goes into the MPEM for corroded pins on either side. You can clean *carefully* the pins, then spray some corrosion protection on either side. Worth a shot and cheaper than new gauges.

 

[JUSS10]

Don’t worry about the pump rattle. It’s normal. It’s because there is play at either end of the shaft. When you’ve got it apart, make sure the rubber bump stops are on either end of the drive shaft. If not, buy some.
Talking of gauges - check the connectors from where the gauges go back to the MPEM. Look for anything that’s worn through. Also check the plug that goes into the MPEM for corroded pins on either side. You can clean *carefully* the pins, then spray some corrosion protection on either side. Worth a shot and cheaper than new gauges.

You know, I've read about those dampers but when i pulled the jet pump off and engine out, I never say one at either end. do they crumble and fall apart after years of use? I'll look closer when I get home later.

 

[JUSS10]

Here are some pictures of the tear down and also the impeller and jet pump parts. I have a small sand blast cabinet at work, can I blast some of the aluminum parts like the nozzle and ring that allows the trim?